300 blk

Park ranger · May 4, 2019

DaemonAssassin said:
Simple physics says otherwise.

Is is time to us explain the 3% math equation for physics and measurement, or should we wait 2 weeks for textbooks to come in? We can recite it all from memory, can you?

Whatever dude, I don't know what your talking about, something to do with this 3% super secret MDS club crap.

I'm telling you, a 220 grain matchking subsonic bullet from a blackout is an icepick, terrible performer on living flesh, but has about the same energy as the 45 acp. I am more than happy to discuss facts and numbers, but beware I not a dipshiit

DaemonAssassin · May 4, 2019

babalou said:
I saw what DA did there..

DaemonAssassin · May 4, 2019

Park ranger said:
Whatever dude, I don't know what your talking about, something to do with this 3% super secret MDS club crap.

I'm telling you, a 220 grain matchking subsonic bullet from a blackout is an icepick, terrible performer on living flesh, but has about the same energy as the 45 acp. I am more than happy to discuss facts and numbers, but beware I not a dipshiit

So first it was a 110gr bullet, now it is a 220gr bullet. Which one is it? Seems as if there is a problem here. 110gr at 2400fps is now a 220gr at a unknown velocity, but we'll assume 2400fps, based on info thus far. A 220gr at 2400fps on a 300BLK, if it didn't grenade the firearm, would explode as soon as it exits the bore, from the centrifugal forces imparted on it by the rifling. As such a 220gr bullet can be pushed at a maximum of 1300fps out of a 300BLK, due to the volume left in the case, after seating the bullet. But then again a 220gr going downrange at 1300fps would cause over pressure and possibly damage the gun. Furthermore a 220gr bullet had a ballistic arc that is the equivalent of a 22LR.

Next?

Park ranger · May 4, 2019

What, go back to your lee loading press rookie.

First, the 110 reference was prior to your conversation with me. For your reference, that load is the 110 Barnes with 19-20 grains of lilgun.

Second, do you know what subsonic means? 2400 fps is not subsonic. Think 1050-1100 fps. I won't confuse you as to why that range fluctuate.

Wtf are you talking about a centrifugal forces at only 2400 ripping apart a bullet? This is news to the F/TR shooters. I'll let Bryan Litz know. (F/TR is a competition shooting prone with a bipod in 308 or 223 out to 1000 yards)

Yeah, no duh subsonic bullets drop at nearly the same rates.

BTW, 12.5 grains of AA1680 should push a 220 to 1300 fps, with around a chamber pressure of 40KSI.

If you have stood on the stage at Camp Perry during the national matches, as I have, forgive me. If not go get your shine box.

DaemonAssassin · May 4, 2019

Park ranger said:
What, go back to your lee loading press rookie.

First, the 110 reference was prior to your conversation with me. For your reference, that load is the 110 Barnes with 19-20 grains of lilgun.

Second, do you know what subsonic means? 2400 fps is not subsonic. Think 1050-1100 fps. I won't confuse you as to why that range fluctuate.

Wtf are you talking about a centrifugal forces at only 2400 ripping apart a bullet? This is news to the F/TR shooters. I'll let Bryan Litz know. (F/TR is a competition shooting prone with a bipod in 308 or 223 out to 1000 yards)

Yeah, no duh subsonic bullets drop at nearly the same rates.

BTW, 12.5 grains of AA1680 should push a 220 to 1300 fps, with around a chamber pressure of 40KSI.

If you have stood on the stage at Camp Perry during the national matches, as I have, forgive me. If not go get your shine box.

Lee? : rolleyes:

Dillon, FTW. 32 years of reloading under my belt, so I'm no rookie.

Yes, I said a 220gr at 2400fps out of a 300BLK barrel with a 1:7 or 1:8 would frag the bullet after it exits the barrel.

It seems as if you don't know as much about the physics regarding projectiles as you think. You are transposing data at will to further a argument that is flawed.

A 220gr out of a 308 at 2400fps with a 1:10 is valid for your statement. Otherwise the statement is severely flawed, if you are attempting to state that is possible with a 300BLK.

As for the speed of sound, it is too be considered roughly 1200fps at sea level. I know what subsonic is and I know the velocity I have to maintain, the charge I need, in order to keep the rounds subsonic.

I don't see how Camp Perry has anything to do with your statements, other than to attempt to give you a illusion of legitimacy to those who don't know any better. Real life is not done on a known distance range.

Best of luck out there, in the parks.

teratos · May 5, 2019

Park ranger said:
The 45bisnt know as a man stopper because of energy.

Um, it is 100% about energy.

My 10.5” 300BLK is sub MOA.

Park ranger · May 5, 2019

Ok, let me try this again. The 45 acp travels at 830 fps with a 230 grain slug. That is 351 foot pounds of energy. (Big whoop)

A blackout can shoot a 220 at 1050 and that is 538 foot pounds of energy. So more than a 45 acp!!! But a 220 matchking is a terrible deer bullet. It cuts right threw like an ice pick.

Momentum or dia of hole is what is helping the 45 acp.

I think it's great everyone has a all-day-long gun. I'm just saying don't chaise your tail worrying about getting sub moa from a bench if you care about "real world".

Learn to shoot offhand, use a sling for sitting and prone. You'll find that sub MOA is now 5-10 moa

outrider58 · May 5, 2019

Park ranger said:
Ok, let me try this again. The 45 acp travels at 830 fps with a 230 grain slug. That is 351 foot pounds of energy. (Big whoop)

A blackout can shoot a 220 at 1050 and that is 538 foot pounds of energy. So more than a 45 acp!!! But a 220 matchking is a terrible deer bullet. It cuts right threw like an ice pick.

Momentum or dia of hole is what is helping the 45 acp.

I think it's great everyone has a all-day-long gun. I'm just saying don't chaise your tail worrying about getting sub moa from a bench if you care about "real world".

Learn to shoot offhand, use a sling for sitting and prone. You'll find that sub MOA is now 5-10 moa

I'm not sure why you keep pulling this bullet into the conversation. No one ever suggested using a 220g MK on deer(or humans, for that matter) in this thread that I'm aware of. Now, I shoot a .308, 194g subsonic bullet/round from my 300 AAC that will open up like a four bladed broadhead. It will not exit a man or deer size carcass.

I'm still waiting for someone to come out with a 220ish copper jacketed lead tipped flat nose bullet in .308 designed specifically for the Blackout. That would put you in the neighborhood of the .45 ACP

DaemonAssassin · May 6, 2019

outrider58 said:
I'm not sure why you keep pulling this bullet into the conversation. No one ever suggested using a 220g MK on deer(or humans, for that matter) in this thread that I'm aware of. Now, I shoot a .308, 194g subsonic bullet/round from my 300 AAC that will open up like a four bladed broadhead. It will not exit a man or deer size carcass.

I'm still waiting for someone to come out with a 220ish copper jacketed lead tipped flat nose bullet in .308 designed specifically for the Blackout. That would put you in the neighborhood of the .45 ACP

Doesn't know of anything other than what he's seen on a store shelf?

Btw is that 194 is a Lehigh controlled chaos?

tmo8320 · May 6, 2019

teratos said:
Um, it is 100% about energy.

My 10.5” 300BLK is sub MOA.

Gulp...sub MOA!!

Yup. Just what I was afraid of.
My stinky shooting skills are entirely to blame.

Back to the range...
Practice, practice, practice

outrider58 · May 6, 2019

DaemonAssassin said:
Doesn't know of anything other than what he's seen on a store shelf?

Btw is that 194 is a Lehigh controlled chaos?

smokey · May 6, 2019

Park ranger said:
Ok, let me try this again. The 45 acp travels at 830 fps with a 230 grain slug. That is 351 foot pounds of energy. (Big whoop)

A blackout can shoot a 220 at 1050 and that is 538 foot pounds of energy. So more than a 45 acp!!! But a 220 matchking is a terrible deer bullet. It cuts right threw like an ice pick.

Momentum or dia of hole is what is helping the 45 acp.

I think it's great everyone has a all-day-long gun. I'm just saying don't chaise your tail worrying about getting sub moa from a bench if you care about "real world".

Learn to shoot offhand, use a sling for sitting and prone. You'll find that sub MOA is now 5-10 moa

fun times with subsonic 300blk. Also, consider the width of the wound channel as the long-assed subsonic loadings tumble. As far as potential mechanical accuracy of a gun....why wouldn't you want the best potential mechanical accuracy possible....especially with all that other error induced by the user?

Speed3 · May 6, 2019

I've shot with Park Ranger before and I've met DA once also, I've got no skin in the game.

I will say that Park Ranger is a good shooter, sling shooter and fclass(although he still can't seem to beat John or Gary haha). But he makes valid points, kill zone on a whitetail is a 8-9" pie plate, chasing 1/4MOA for a deer rifle doesn't make tons of sense. Shooting in awkward positions in the tree stand takes that 1/4" MOA gun and opens it up to 3" gun lets say. Using a Match bullet like 220 SMK, will literally just poke holes in the deer if THAT bullet was to be used.

However, the 194gr Lehigh's like mentioned above work well( I have some). Although I wouldn't take anything more than a 50 yard shot with them but that is for my own personal reason. If i'm jumping in the woods behind my house, I grab those suppressed as to not piss off the neighbors. If i'm going to be shooting 100 yards or beyond, 300BLK isn't my choice, I have better guns ballistically to do the job.

DaemonAssassin · May 6, 2019

DD989 said:
Gulp...sub MOA!!

Yup. Just what I was afraid of.

My stinky shooting skills are entirely to blame.

Back to the range...

Practice, practice, practice

How do you get to Carnegie Hall? Keep practicing!

DaemonAssassin · May 6, 2019

outrider58 said:

Ha! Sneaky sneaky.

outrider58 · May 6, 2019

smokey0118 said:
fun times with subsonic 300blk. Also, consider the width of the wound channel as the long-assed subsonic loadings tumble. As far as potential mechanical accuracy of a gun....why wouldn't you want the best potential mechanical accuracy possible....especially with all that other error induced by the user?

Exactly!

It's nothing personal against anyone else here, i just don't agree with "it is what it is, so why make it better?" If we all had that attitude, we'd still be living in caves throwing rocks at our prey.

If you're the kind of person who only relies on the double lung shot, then have at it. I'm an aim small, miss small kind of guy. I shoot my bow out to 60 yds. I don't shoot deer with it that far, but it allows me to place my arrow more accurately out to 30 yds without any fuss. It should be the same way with firearms. MHO

Park ranger · May 6, 2019

All in good fun. Get your shine box is often stated , even a meme sometimes. Just ball busting, cause . No true offence ment nor taken.

outrider58 · May 7, 2019

Park ranger said:
All in good fun. Get your shine box is often stated , even a meme sometimes. Just ball busting, cause . No true offence ment nor taken.

Ah! So you were only trolling us. All better now. Great fun for everyone. :rolleyes:

outrider58 · May 10, 2019

Three shot group with 110gr supers and a cluster of 220gr ELD-X subsonics. Both shot from 10.5" barrel @ 100 yds, sandbag rest.

smokey · Jun 6, 2021

Anyone have experience with herters 125 gr 300 blk open tip? Bass pro had some in stock and I grabbed it. I didn't notice it was a crimped open tip until it arrived. It looks like this would likely expand and fragment if it hit soft squishy things.

Anyone know of any gel tests with this? Also Anyone know what kind of accuracy/reliability to expect? At $1.15/round, it's down in price with wolf, but brass cased. If this fragments and also has somewhat decent person-performance, I'll likely be picking up more. Soooo, whatsayyou mdshooters braintrust?

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