Shells for HD. What should I use?

smokey · Mar 30, 2014

Sling Blade said:
What are your opinions on these?

you're looking at about 19" of penetration in 10% gel and a 1" expanded diameter. They're relatively cheap, but that's too much penetration for HD. I'd want something that stops before 15".

In contrast, here's some cheap winchester slugs that break apart and only penetrate to 12" or so.

...of course they still punch through hard barriers pretty well...so may not be the best for HD.

Vile Shadow · Mar 30, 2014

That's kinda what I thought.

This is what I have in my HD shotgun now.

BossmanPJ · Mar 30, 2014

I have the Winchester military spec 00 buck in my hd shotgun as well. the walls on my home are thin and a slug would easily go through them.

smokey · Mar 30, 2014

Sling Blade said:
That's kinda what I thought.

This is what I have in my HD shotgun now.

bossmanpj said:
I have the Winchester military spec 00 buck in my hd shotgun as well. the walls on my home are thin and a slug would easily go through them.

Buyer beware, the winchester military OO seems to be a pretty big ripoff and far from the best load.
http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=224340

It looks cool, but doesn't even have a shot cup of any kind. Unless you find it dirt cheap, there's better stuff for the money.

The load I'm trying to get ahold of that will likely be my HD shell is this...
http://www.policehq.com/Products/FC-132LE.1B#.Uziw5ldTQYU
federal's 2 3/4" #1 buck tactical load with flitecontrol wad. I don't think you can really beat it with any other load out today.
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot56.htm

swinokur · Mar 30, 2014

I use what Smokey wants to use. Tight groups, lots of surface area with 15 pellets.

joppaj · Apr 1, 2014

The Federal is easily the best I've ever tested.

eruby · Apr 1, 2014

Scarab said:
True. Good food for thought. Just like all of us I'm sure, I don't want to kill someone if at all possible to avoid it. Maim, incapacitate, or hurt badly, but not kill unless there is no other choice.
Scarab

Shoot to stop the threat. The outcome can be one of the above bolded.

alucard0822 · Apr 1, 2014

smokey0118 said:
you're looking at about 19" of penetration in 10% gel and a 1" expanded diameter. They're relatively cheap, but that's too much penetration for HD. I'd want something that stops before 15".

In contrast, here's some cheap winchester slugs that break apart and only penetrate to 12" or so.

...of course they still punch through hard barriers pretty well...so may not be the best for HD.

I like the managed recoil Brennekes, accurate, mild recoil, and all but guaranteed to penetrate reliably. I'm not that worried about "over-penetration", I figure worst case a clear miss is going to be heading through several walls, if not all the way out of the house in any caliber large enough to stop a threat quickly. I want a round that I can shoot fast, shoot accurately, and shoot easily, and that has the best chance of absolutely destroying the threat in the fewest rounds possible. All things considered, those Brennekes probably penetrate through fewer walls than the 7.62 AK I keep loaded in the office on the other side of the house.

mrozowjj · Apr 2, 2014

Ideally #1 buckshot but since that is going to be hard to find stick with 00 buck. Buy a few different round and find a range where you can pattern them at 15 yards. Despite what movies would have you believe you want the one with the tightest group at that distance.

swinokur · Apr 2, 2014

You can buy the Federal 01 15 pellet buck pretty easily. I bought a bunch from Ammunition Depot.

LE132 1b

http://le.atk.com/ammunition/federal/buckshot/details.aspx?id=998

ETA-I bought this stuff last August.

Sirex · Apr 2, 2014

I have a round of #1 first in the tube, then a couple rounds of OO buck, and the last round is a Centurion which is a .68 ball followed by #1 or #4, can't remember, I'll have to read the bx when I get home. I figured if it gets that far, the last thing I'll have to worry about is overpenetration.

Boats · Apr 2, 2014

00 buck

Boxcab · Apr 9, 2014

Another thought for those who consider a "lesser" round in the number 1 position. The lone bad guy is the minority. Most likely you will face two or more intruders. Does that change your loading strategy?

My philosophy is to load to stop the threat with each and every pull of the trigger. In the legal world, if you point a gun at someone, you have crossed a line of no return. There are no brownie points given for less "lethal ammo" or even an empty gun, it is all treated, and prosecuted, the same.

If you feel you need to down load to protect innocents on the other side of the wall, consider hardening those positions (layers of thin steel and/or plywood to build up head boards), relocating, etc. Just because you download, don't expect the bad guys to have the same courtesy.

SCARCQB · Apr 9, 2014

I have switched to #1 buckshot. Holds a denser pattern at longer ranges. Follwed by 00 buck and slugs.

pbharvey · Apr 11, 2014

Interesting chart regarding spread

http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/20447/buckshot-basics/

Fishguy · Apr 11, 2014

pbharvey said:
Interesting chart regarding spread

http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/20447/buckshot-basics/

Well, that kind of refutes the #1 buck holds a denser pattern idea. I think the pattern density is more of a function of shot cup design than anything, but there is no refuting that #1 has more surface area and therefore causes more tissue damage than 00 if all the pellets go into the target.

daNattyFatty · Apr 13, 2014

Fishguy said:
Well, that kind of refutes the #1 buck holds a denser pattern idea. I think the pattern density is more of a function of shot cup design than anything, but there is no refuting that #1 has more surface area and therefore causes more tissue damage than 00 if all the pellets go into the target.

Federal's #1 with flite control wad will practically pattern like a slug at 15 yards.

hdatontodo · Jun 1, 2014

This reminded me of the audio from a driver's ed video but was an interesting comparison of shotgun ammo / loads

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAeeRdd4YwI

(DUP prevention advisory. I did try to search for the video ID)

Scharfshutzek98 · Jun 2, 2014

I use #4 bird shot.

smokey · Jun 2, 2014

pbharvey said:
Interesting chart regarding spread

http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/20447/buckshot-basics/

Something is wayyyyyyyyyy off with that chart. Hornady's critical defense should be patterning MUCH tighter. It uses essentially the same wad as the federal flitecontrol. Hornady calls it the versatite. The pattern SHOULD be closer to 8-9" at 25 yards, something close to but maybe slightly larger than the federal.

Shells for HD. What should I use?

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