Go Back   Maryland Shooters > The Neighborhood > West Virginia

Notices


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old March 17th, 2017, 04:53 PM #1
Lennyo3034 Lennyo3034 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 424
Lennyo3034 Lennyo3034 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 424
Peacemaker getting sued, released member info

Did anyone else get the email from peacemaker saying they were forced to release member info to the plaintiffs?

I don't know much else but the case was:

Ben and Diane Goldstein v. Peacemaker Properties, LLC and Peacemaker National Training Center, LLC
Lennyo3034 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 05:20 PM #2
Tactics's Avatar
Tactics Tactics is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Happy to be Here
Posts: 2,569
Tactics Tactics is offline
Senior Member
Tactics's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Happy to be Here
Posts: 2,569
Uh oh.. staying tuned.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Tactics is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 05:24 PM #3
Qbeam's Avatar
Qbeam Qbeam is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Maryland
Posts: 3,008
Qbeam Qbeam is offline
Senior Member
Qbeam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Maryland
Posts: 3,008
Noise complaint?
Qbeam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 05:25 PM #4
Schipperke's Avatar
Schipperke Schipperke is offline
Capt. Snarky
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Монтгомери
Posts: 11,825
Schipperke Schipperke is offline
Capt. Snarky
Schipperke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Монтгомери
Posts: 11,825
Press Release

Attached
Attached Images
File Type: pdf PNTC press release 3.17.2017.pdf (439.9 KB, 459 views)
Schipperke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 05:30 PM #5
Qbeam's Avatar
Qbeam Qbeam is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Maryland
Posts: 3,008
Qbeam Qbeam is offline
Senior Member
Qbeam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Maryland
Posts: 3,008
Sad, just like the folks that move next to airport and complain about the noise....

Hope Peacemaker wins.

Q
Qbeam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 05:38 PM #6
Schipperke's Avatar
Schipperke Schipperke is offline
Capt. Snarky
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Монтгомери
Posts: 11,825
Schipperke Schipperke is offline
Capt. Snarky
Schipperke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Монтгомери
Posts: 11,825
What is really strange, here is the attorney of the plaintiff. California Lawyer.. Related to plaintiffs?
Schipperke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 05:48 PM #7
pbharvey's Avatar
pbharvey pbharvey is online now
Habitual Testifier
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 15,263
pbharvey pbharvey is online now
Habitual Testifier
pbharvey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 15,263
How loud can a place named "peace maker" be?
I got the email. I'm not a member but I've shot there. The place is huge, seems odd that anyone would be close enough to be bothered.
__________________
Brian

"The heart of the matter then is not the existence of guns, knives or pressure cookers, it is this: It’s the evil lurking in the hearts of people. And there is only one solution to that problem.
His name is Jesus Christ, and the change He brings to a person’s heart is the ultimate cure for the violence and wickedness that surrounds us." Jim Daly
pbharvey is online now   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 05:53 PM #8
iH8DemLibz's Avatar
iH8DemLibz iH8DemLibz is online now
When All Else Fails.
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Libtardistan
Posts: 20,011
iH8DemLibz iH8DemLibz is online now
When All Else Fails.
iH8DemLibz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Libtardistan
Posts: 20,011
Since when does being bothered and trampling on gun rights have to jive?

The big push by the Grabbers is on.
iH8DemLibz is online now   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 06:14 PM #9
dist1646 dist1646 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Eldersburg
Posts: 4,985
dist1646 dist1646 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Eldersburg
Posts: 4,985
dist1646 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 06:14 PM #10
Schipperke's Avatar
Schipperke Schipperke is offline
Capt. Snarky
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Монтгомери
Posts: 11,825
Schipperke Schipperke is offline
Capt. Snarky
Schipperke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Монтгомери
Posts: 11,825
Home is about 1km West in Virginia. May be half a mile actually from where rifles are firing it appears.
Schipperke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 06:16 PM #11
snallygaster's Avatar
snallygaster snallygaster is offline
Old Appalachia
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wintergreen, VA
Posts: 7,425
snallygaster snallygaster is offline
Old Appalachia
snallygaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wintergreen, VA
Posts: 7,425
I'm guessing it's these two - Bennett and Diane of Winchester, VA. Both appear to be around 70.

Can someone post a link to the court documents? WV makes it very difficult.
snallygaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 06:28 PM #12
swinokur's Avatar
swinokur swinokur is online now
In a State of Denial
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Stalag Montgomery
Posts: 36,783
swinokur swinokur is online now
In a State of Denial
swinokur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Stalag Montgomery
Posts: 36,783
WVCDL put out an alert about this yesterday.

https://www.mdshooters.com/showpost....1&postcount=13
__________________
swinokur is online now   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 08:13 PM #13
davsco's Avatar
davsco davsco is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Loudoun, VA
Posts: 3,982
davsco davsco is online now
Senior Member
davsco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Loudoun, VA
Posts: 3,982
while it seems WV doesn't allow noise and related lawsuits against shooting ranges, thinking that doesn't prevent citizens on nearby properties but in different states (the case here, plaintiff lives in VA, range is in WV) from bringing suit. IANAL so my thinking may be incorrect. bottom line is that even if the plaintiffs don't win on the merits of their case, they still can cost the defendant a large amount of money and disruption to their business, and potential alienation of their customers (though i personally could care less if my name, as a member or customer shooting a match, is made public). i will say while shooting there, on at least several occasions i have heard gunfire over the hills, including full auto, that must have been from another public or private range nearby. so the plaintiffs are going to have to somehow make clear to the courts what noises from where are disturbing them.
davsco is online now   Reply With Quote
Old March 17th, 2017, 11:49 PM #14
MontaniSemperLiberi MontaniSemperLiberi is offline
MD Survivor
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: West By'God Virginia
Posts: 366
MontaniSemperLiberi MontaniSemperLiberi is offline
MD Survivor
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: West By'God Virginia
Posts: 366
Thumbs down

Quote:
Originally Posted by davsco View Post
while it seems WV doesn't allow noise and related lawsuits against shooting ranges, thinking that doesn't prevent citizens on nearby properties but in different states (the case here, plaintiff lives in VA, range is in WV) from bringing suit. IANAL so my thinking may be incorrect. bottom line is that even if the plaintiffs don't win on the merits of their case, they still can cost the defendant a large amount of money and disruption to their business, and potential alienation of their customers (though i personally could care less if my name, as a member or customer shooting a match, is made public). i will say while shooting there, on at least several occasions i have heard gunfire over the hills, including full auto, that must have been from another public or private range nearby. so the plaintiffs are going to have to somehow make clear to the courts what noises from where are disturbing them.
1. Only Berkeley County and a few other areas have localized laws to protect ranges.

2. There is currently legislation for statewide protection that just left the Senate Judiciary.

3. Who said it was just a name? What about EVERY ounce of information you provided on ANY form to Peacemaker? That includes 4473s, etc. You may not be concerned... which is how rights get trampled because folks only care if they're personally impacted.

4. There's a reason that the lawsuit is taking place in West Virginia, because that is where the civil issue is taking place. PNTC is in WV. The Goldsteins literally live across the state line with their property directly adjacent PNTC. To be tried in Virginia, PNTC where the "nuisance" is taking place would have to be in Virginia as well.

5. The judge hearing the case flat-out ignored that Berk Co. has a law protecting ranges... Among many other snafus that higher courts have had to correct, it wasn't too long ago that he tried to make a bunch of sexual abuse victims pay half of the legal fees of the abuser. The WV Supreme Court of Appeals slapped him down, pointing it was an attempt to cover his incorrect appointment of an ad litem counsel to the defendant that incurred the cost to begin with, never mind the atrocity of trying to make the parents of kids who'd been sexually abused pay to defend the man who victimized their children -- yet this clown keeps getting re-elected.

Sorry if I come across as snippy, but as an effected party *I* (among many others) am NOT okay with all of the personal information I've ever provided to Peacemaker to be disclosed.

It's even more frustrating when I've watched groups of folks turn their backs on others simply because it does not affect them greatly; if at all. It happens too often within the firearms community between the diverse demographics of types of firearms and their various uses. Folks who do so are not only at fault for sitting idly by while rights are stripped; but also standing in the way of restoring rights to what they should be.
__________________

NRA Life Member x2 (lol?) | NRA Certified Instructor | WVCDL Member
The Reverb Lounge | WV Marksmen Community
CHECK OUT MY eBAY STORE FOR USED TECH GEAR!!!

"I survived 5 years in Maryland... and all I got was this lousy Constitutional Butthurt"
MontaniSemperLiberi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 18th, 2017, 04:05 AM #15
TheGunnyRet's Avatar
TheGunnyRet TheGunnyRet is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Hedgesville, WV
Posts: 2,032
TheGunnyRet TheGunnyRet is offline
Senior Member
TheGunnyRet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Hedgesville, WV
Posts: 2,032
SB575

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lennyo3034 View Post
Did anyone else get the email from peacemaker saying they were forced to release member info to the plaintiffs?

I don't know much else but the case was:

Ben and Diane Goldstein v. Peacemaker Properties, LLC and Peacemaker National Training Center, LLC
https://www.mdshooters.com/showpost....1&postcount=18
__________________
President Trump

"My job is not to represent the world. My job is to represent the U.S. of A."

“Following your convictions means you must be willing to face criticism from those who lack the same courage,”

“in America we don’t worship government, we worship God.”

AIM = AMERICANS AGAINST ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION MILITIA.


GYSGT USMC Ret
TheGunnyRet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 18th, 2017, 08:27 PM #16
ten75ice's Avatar
ten75ice ten75ice is offline
Career Fire Fighter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Falling Waters, WV
Posts: 258
ten75ice ten75ice is offline
Career Fire Fighter
ten75ice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Falling Waters, WV
Posts: 258
Here is the Gofundme link for our legal defense. Thanks again everyone for being supportive neighbors.

https://www.gofundme.com/mvc.php?rou...erm=Peacemaker
__________________
Down Zero at Peacemaker National Training Center

Glengary, WV

Certifications are not a measure of your abilities, unless you are measuring your ability to sit in a classroom.
ten75ice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 18th, 2017, 09:12 PM #17
Not_an_outlaw Not_an_outlaw is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Mechanicsville, MD
Posts: 1,840
Not_an_outlaw Not_an_outlaw is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Mechanicsville, MD
Posts: 1,840
I'm a little confused about the information requested by the plaintiff Doesn't there have to be a nexus between the issue at hand and the information requested
Not_an_outlaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 19th, 2017, 12:41 AM #18
jcutonilli jcutonilli is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 414
jcutonilli jcutonilli is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 414
Quote:
Originally Posted by Not_an_outlaw View Post
I'm a little confused about the information requested by the plaintiff Doesn't there have to be a nexus between the issue at hand and the information requested
It could be argued that the range itself does not generate any noise and that the individuals using the range are the ones generating the noise so they have a right to know the names of the people generating the noise ie its users.
jcutonilli is online now   Reply With Quote
Old March 19th, 2017, 02:53 AM #19
TheGunnyRet's Avatar
TheGunnyRet TheGunnyRet is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Hedgesville, WV
Posts: 2,032
TheGunnyRet TheGunnyRet is offline
Senior Member
TheGunnyRet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Hedgesville, WV
Posts: 2,032
It is a Cross State issue and there is State Sovereignty in question regarding the Noise Nuisance Protection Law for WV Ranges, But it seems to be more of a Gun-Grabbers via a different approach by collecting/suing for Private information.

This is where the HPA would be a viable application...
__________________
President Trump

"My job is not to represent the world. My job is to represent the U.S. of A."

“Following your convictions means you must be willing to face criticism from those who lack the same courage,”

“in America we don’t worship government, we worship God.”

AIM = AMERICANS AGAINST ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION MILITIA.


GYSGT USMC Ret
TheGunnyRet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 19th, 2017, 08:16 AM #20
mesmithwesson mesmithwesson is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 511
mesmithwesson mesmithwesson is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 511
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGunnyRet View Post
It is a Cross State issue and there is State Sovereignty in question regarding the Noise Nuisance Protection Law for WV Ranges, But it seems to be more of a Gun-Grabbers via a different approach by collecting/suing for Private information.

This is where the HPA would be a viable application...
I think its time for a huge jamboree there all day every weekend for a year with 50 cal ringing out four times an hour!

__________________
NRA Member
mesmithwesson is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

  Home Page > Forum List > The Neighborhood > West Virginia


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:02 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
© 2017, Congregate Media, LP Privacy Policy Terms of Service