Do a poll/survey here and you'll find that 99.99% of us with firearms in our houses think O'Malley's plan is trash
New Goucher College poll is bad news for us
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Consider that if it's Goucher College's poll, then my guess is that it would be comprised of mostly Goucher students, and at this point in time college students are overwhelmingly liberal. My 19 year old niece voted for Obama, and couldn't be disuaded by her father, who is without a doubt conservative Christian. She was raised that way, but college has a way of warping kids's minds...until they have to get out in the real world, get a real job, pay real taxes, etc.
But anyway, to put that into perspective, my niece would be one to say that yes, there are guns in the house, but yes, she supports licensing and fingerprinting. She's still young and naive enough to think it's a good idea and to have her name and fingerprints on file with the state.
But anyway, to put that into perspective, my niece would be one to say that yes, there are guns in the house, but yes, she supports licensing and fingerprinting. She's still young and naive enough to think it's a good idea and to have her name and fingerprints on file with the state.
R1Peacock
Active Member
Goucher College --- that place is nothing but Lesbians, Art Lovers and Tree Huggers. I wouldn't say it's an accurate poll that reflects general society. Go poll a college in Wyoming and see the results. It would be opposite --- nearly 100% pro gun..... Surveys and "random" polls are a bunch of BS.
RP
RP
rnfjr6950
Member
Colleen Barry, associate professor and associate chair for research and practice, the Johns Hopkins "Bloomberg" School of Public Health
Completely Unbiased I'm sure!
Last edited:
Exactly. There's bound to be a big difference in the results between asking "do you support fingerprinting and licensing of all handgun buyers in addition to the criminal history and mental health background check and 7-day wait already imposed by Maryland"
or asking
"do you think people should be able to buy a handgun at any time from anyone with no background check or should they be fingerprinted and licensed first" (<---read the last part fast, too, temp poll agency worker).
I have no idea how they posed the questions but I can guess how they were slanted.
oupa
Active Member
- Apr 6, 2011
- 859
Should have been worded as follows;
I suspect the results would have been considerably different.
AimsWellShootsWorse
Active Member
The methodology is published here: http://marylandreporter.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/March-2013-Goucher-Poll-Results-Wednesday.pdf
Includes demographics of respondents and all survey questions.
And I hate to say it, but most of the questions are worded quite plainly (aside from the always-vague term "assault rifle").
So the fact remains: why are so many Marylanders in gun-owning households so apparently supportive of---or at least amenable to---these new measures? My guesses:
1) In the sample, many from such households were not the gun-owners themselves. I know many marriages where husband is a gun-owner and wife is much less enthusiastic about firearms. Depends on who answers the pollster.
2) Confirming that theory, a recent Post poll showed that of the 29% of respondents in "gun-owning households," only 2/3 had personally purchased a firearm in the past ten years. If that is meant to represent gun-owners, I expect it is somewhat misleading; if it represents a mix of respondents (some gun-owners and some non-gun-owners who share a household with a gun-owner) it is much more believable.
3) Too many gun-owners are in fact not just resigned but amenable to new restrictions, even if they do not understand the extent of the hassle and hazard they are inviting.
The very unfortunate political reality in Maryland seems to be that gun-owners (compared to non-gun-owners) are disproportionately concentrated in the less populated, least Democratic portions of the state (no great surprise, really) and distributed too diffusely in the mega-counties of Central Maryland, blunting some of our strength in Annapolis. But also many gun-owners (esp. those who are Democrats, not DINOs) are amendable to finger-printing and licensing in part, I presume, because they are disturbed (as we all are) by the levels of illegal gun violence in this state, especially PG and Baltimore City. However, unlike most of us in this forum, they seem to believe that the regulation of legal sales won't much affect them, and will likely reduce the supply of guns to criminals.
That's wrong, of course, given that from 2004-2011 alone there where 700,000 NICS background checks in Maryland. That doesn't count the secondary sales which don't require a NICS check or cases where new residents bring their own guns. Just implausible that impediments and restrictions on future primary sales will make a significant difference to the illegal supply of firearms to felons.
Speculating, I also think that many gun-owners in Maryland are not as often "single-issue" voters as in some parts of the country. Whatever their views, they fit into a larger mix of perceptions, values, and partisan commitments. In other words, I tend to think that in Maryland, gun owners who lean Democratic are more likely to be more passionate about being a Democrat than they are passionate about firearms. Just a guess, really, but the norms in the state's most populous counties would seem to support this idea. May be obvious.
Feel free to disagree with me. But what we need to get a better understanding of is why, unfortunately, poll after poll seems to suggest that some, many--too many--Maryland gun-owners are not strongly opposed to licensing and finger-printing (even when many of us are). Remember, we here in this forum are the most passionate about our rights and the shooting sports. Let's not assume most Maryland gun-owners necessarily think like us.
Figuring this out is a key prerequisite to persuading them to get active in defense of our rights. And their rights, too. For the future, if not against the current round of bad bills.
In the meantime, we need to do all we can to win amendments to soften the impact of the O'Malley steamroller....
Includes demographics of respondents and all survey questions.
And I hate to say it, but most of the questions are worded quite plainly (aside from the always-vague term "assault rifle").
So the fact remains: why are so many Marylanders in gun-owning households so apparently supportive of---or at least amenable to---these new measures? My guesses:
1) In the sample, many from such households were not the gun-owners themselves. I know many marriages where husband is a gun-owner and wife is much less enthusiastic about firearms. Depends on who answers the pollster.
2) Confirming that theory, a recent Post poll showed that of the 29% of respondents in "gun-owning households," only 2/3 had personally purchased a firearm in the past ten years. If that is meant to represent gun-owners, I expect it is somewhat misleading; if it represents a mix of respondents (some gun-owners and some non-gun-owners who share a household with a gun-owner) it is much more believable.
3) Too many gun-owners are in fact not just resigned but amenable to new restrictions, even if they do not understand the extent of the hassle and hazard they are inviting.
The very unfortunate political reality in Maryland seems to be that gun-owners (compared to non-gun-owners) are disproportionately concentrated in the less populated, least Democratic portions of the state (no great surprise, really) and distributed too diffusely in the mega-counties of Central Maryland, blunting some of our strength in Annapolis. But also many gun-owners (esp. those who are Democrats, not DINOs) are amendable to finger-printing and licensing in part, I presume, because they are disturbed (as we all are) by the levels of illegal gun violence in this state, especially PG and Baltimore City. However, unlike most of us in this forum, they seem to believe that the regulation of legal sales won't much affect them, and will likely reduce the supply of guns to criminals.
That's wrong, of course, given that from 2004-2011 alone there where 700,000 NICS background checks in Maryland. That doesn't count the secondary sales which don't require a NICS check or cases where new residents bring their own guns. Just implausible that impediments and restrictions on future primary sales will make a significant difference to the illegal supply of firearms to felons.
Speculating, I also think that many gun-owners in Maryland are not as often "single-issue" voters as in some parts of the country. Whatever their views, they fit into a larger mix of perceptions, values, and partisan commitments. In other words, I tend to think that in Maryland, gun owners who lean Democratic are more likely to be more passionate about being a Democrat than they are passionate about firearms. Just a guess, really, but the norms in the state's most populous counties would seem to support this idea. May be obvious.
Feel free to disagree with me. But what we need to get a better understanding of is why, unfortunately, poll after poll seems to suggest that some, many--too many--Maryland gun-owners are not strongly opposed to licensing and finger-printing (even when many of us are). Remember, we here in this forum are the most passionate about our rights and the shooting sports. Let's not assume most Maryland gun-owners necessarily think like us.
Figuring this out is a key prerequisite to persuading them to get active in defense of our rights. And their rights, too. For the future, if not against the current round of bad bills.
In the meantime, we need to do all we can to win amendments to soften the impact of the O'Malley steamroller....
Oh. Now I understand.
Your comments are right on target. The folks who think this was an all-biased poll have their heads in the sand. People are used to having everything licensed and taxed now and I think a lot don't see this any differently. My wife still doesn't believe I don't have a "license".
smores
Creepy-Ass Cracker
This. /thread
People really need to become enlightened on the context of the founding documents and why they were ratified, as well as the intent of the founders!
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Brooklyn
I stand with John Locke.
You are assuming way to much.
"assault rifle" is not vague-- its prejudicial period.
like wise "high capacity"
I forget the rest. Do not assume good faith.
"gun owner" is also a pile of dung.
No follow up on that... No info on knowledge of existing law.
This is a standard push poll. That is all.
danb
dont be a dumbass
some thoughts from some friends who dont own guns:
1. "Why not I get fingerprinted for my [job, TSA security, ...]" Unfortunately, maryland is a place where many do people get fingerprinted, especially in Howard and Montgomery County. This does not affect anyone they know. In their mind it affects "them" - whoever that is.
2. Unfamiliarity with current laws. most people have not bought a gun in forever. Most people don't even know about the online safety requirement.
3. they feel pretty safe. "hey, why would i need a gun for self defense, i live in a nice neighborhood?" "i could just buy a shotgun anyway." "this does not affect hunters." If you ask them "do i have a right to have a handgun for self defense" you will get a nearly universal yes. how many hoops should i jump through? well hey we have all been fingerprinted its not a big deal... see #1. anyway, "why cant you just buy a shotgun?"
part of the problem here as i see it is a mindset that shotguns are ok, whereas handguns have "intent." The conversation is often: do you have a shotgun? yes. is it locked up? yes. oh, ok.
Do you have a handgun? yes. Who are you going to shoot?
Even among people i know who are thinking about buying first time, the idea does not sound bad. They think it wont apply to them as long as they buy before the new law, or wont be a big deal.
Until you walk them through the process and enormous wait times right now. Quite frankly, i am kinda hoping that the admin makes it super ridiculously onerous, that way people will see it as a big deal and de facto ban and there is a backlash.
JMO. id like to see a deeper poll on attidutes.
Brooklyn
I stand with John Locke.
You are assuming way to much.
"assault rifle" is not vague-- its prejudicial period.
like wise "high capacity"
I forget the rest. Do not assume good faith.
"gun owner" is also a pile of dung.
No follow up on that... No info on knowledge of existing law.
This is a standard push poll. That is all.
Also notice the use of probe questions.. This is a big issue. it is intended to shift options to the extreme. But in practice it may push people to the middle to end the interaction or avoid the disapproval of thee questioner. I almost certainly will cause persons to take positions on issues they know little about.
So how about fingerprinting for hand guns?
hum well ok I think ?
Are you in favor ??!!!
well maybe?
ok.
or Well yes I favor fingerprinting..
Would you say strongly favor ??!!! ( hopeful friendly voice most likely young and female.....)
un well...
You sound committed ..
ok well
Ok great !!!! ( over joyed possible orgasmic )
I have seen it done, I have watched young women flirt and even start to disrobe to get the right answer( well it was a marketing survey about middle aged men and sports cars... but the principle holds. )
AimsWellShootsWorse
Active Member
Push polls are paid for by clients; this one is not. Push polls are usually nakedly skewed; this is not. Probing for intensity is a standard polling technique. It can be abused, but doesn't mean it was. If you're going to critique it, please rely on the facts we have available from this particular poll, this particular sample.
Prior poster nails some of the issues at work in these measured attitudes. Makes sense. This is the climate in which we must operate in Maryland, like it or not. Even among gun-owners, we have much persuading to do.
Brooklyn
I stand with John Locke.
So you think the poll was not paid for? You think Goucher is neutral on the issue?. And if you think terms like assault weapon and High capacity are not nakedly skewed then I guess we will have to disagree and move on.
I does not take much to convince gun owners. You start by avoiding terms like high capacity. Then ask if clips contain bullets. If they say yes then they are likely not a gun owner. If they insist that they are I point out that they would fail the licence exam. This gets their attention. Then I tell them that its sniper rifles ( aka bolt guns) that are next . It takes about 10 min. But this does not get them active it just gets them more informed.
I stand by my assessment. This is part of the same disinformation machine that wants us to quit and calls us a vocal minority run by the NRA.
ToneGrail
MSI, NRA, & SAF Member
Goucher. LOL. I had a bandmate who attended Goucher. All his friends who used to come to our shows were either dance or poetry majors with extremely wealthy parents. They were all spoiled little princesses who couldn't hack majoring in something that was actually useful or practical.
A few of them were OWS protesters.
SomeGuy
Active Member
Someone here has a sig that states a quote from President Lincoln famously stated that 74% of all facts are made up numbers.
- Oct 25, 2012
- 3,366
If I read this right then 2/3s are not gun owners. I am not going to ask a group of vegetarians what the best cut of steak is.
TxAggie
Ultimate Member
Then these same people should have shown up in support of the AWB bills. It's easy to say "yeah, whatever. That sounds good" on the phone to a pollster.
I don't trust ANY polls, even those that favor us because the questions are always leading.
I don't trust ANY polls, even those that favor us because the questions are always leading.
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