Fire Call!!!! Dems attempting to ram SB741/HB888...

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  • Jul 1, 2012
    5,711
    A copy of what I sent. Taylored towards each member of the GA

    If it was me, I'd redact my name and zip code from a public post in these trying times:)
    But you're using "code names" right?
     

    Allen65

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jun 29, 2013
    7,063
    Anne Arundel County
    One thing that I noticed in section 4-306 of the bill was this sentence: "A person who uses an assault weapon, A RAPID FIRE TRIGGER ACTIVATOR,
    or a magazine that has a capacity of more than 10 rounds of ammunition..."

    Granted this talks about during the commission of a crime, but this is the first time that I have seen large magazines mentioned. Is this language currently in effect? Just showing my legal ignorance.

    The magazine language was part of FSA2013. It's an add-on charge to use a standard capacity magazine in a crime of violence.
     

    mac1_131

    MSI Executive Member
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 31, 2009
    3,280
    Couple things to note here. Since they are hearing this bill jointly, I think that means vallerio won't be able to put it in the desk drawer. I think this is a real sign they want this bill to move.

    I think it also means they will vote together on this since they are hearing it jointly.

    They have additional hearings on other bills at 3pm. That gives them less than 2 hours to hear this bill.

    To sign up to testify, I think I read the sign up list will be in vallerio's office. They always let the proponents testify first. The opponents (that's us) will probably testify last, with whatever time is left.

    So word to the wise here, if you want to testify get there early and get signed up.

    This is going down like FSA2013, and I bet they plan on voting on it before the session ends so they can override any potential veto in this session.

    Sorry for all the good news, but this is how they roll when Mike and Mike really want something to pass.
     

    GolfR

    Ultimate Member
    Oct 20, 2016
    1,324
    Columbia MD
    So here is the biggest problem with this law, it doesn’t have a grandfather clause, so anyone with an aftermarket trigger already in their gun is in violation.

    This said, if you build a gun yourself from a lower, what is the designed rate of fire? Essentially, you have designed the gun. This is especially true for an 80% lower.
     

    dlmarion

    Active Member
    Feb 6, 2013
    824
    Carroll County
    This said, if you build a gun yourself from a lower, what is the designed rate of fire?

    The way that this is currently written all firearms that fire faster than the slowest firearm in the universe have a "rapid fire trigger activator". There is no other test in the language. It does not provide a test against original manufacturers equipment, other firearms in the same class, etc. I don't see how this stands up in court.

    EDIT: IANAL
     

    fidelity

    piled higher and deeper
    MDS Supporter
    Aug 15, 2012
    22,400
    Frederick County
    Read the bill, it will sweep up much more than trigger cranks and bump stocks. Get a trigger job on your 1911? BANNED! Install and aftermarket 3.5lb trigger in your AR? BANNED! Install an Apex flat faced 5 lb trigger in your Glock or M&P pistol? BANNED!




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Would it encompass triggers in bolt action hunting rifles too? Timney trigger drop-ins are quite common. Lighter triggers improve accuracy which leads to more humane kills. What of guns with recalled triggers (like the widely sold Remington 700)? A lot of folks replaced these themselves, often with an upgraded trigger. So now they become criminals for taking care of a safety defect?

    Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
     

    Rab1515

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Apr 29, 2014
    2,081
    Calvert
    The way that this is currently written all firearms that fire faster than the slowest firearm in the universe have a "rapid fire trigger activator". There is no other test in the language. It does not provide a test against original manufacturers equipment, other firearms in the same class, etc. I don't see how this stands up in court.

    EDIT: IANAL

    Normally I would say your right, but this in MD and 4th circus(pun intended). If you wanted to get really tecnical the rate of fire is 0 without a trigger group.
     

    Onceuponatime

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Feb 19, 2018
    504
    Would it encompass triggers in bolt action hunting rifles too? Timney trigger drop-ins are quite common. Lighter triggers improve accuracy which leads to more humane kills. What of guns with recalled triggers (like the widely sold Remington 700)? A lot of folks replaced these themselves, often with an upgraded trigger. So now they become criminals for taking care of a safety defect?

    Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

    It sounds like they are going to pass it without considering the emmense amount of issues that will get dragged into and bascally let all the resulting action be settled in court cases down the road. If you can afford it......
     

    danimalw

    Ultimate Member
    Thanks for some suggestions of what to write... my version

    Honorable Senators and Delegates,

    I am writing to ask for you to oppose subject bill. As with most gun control bills, it will not prevent violence. In addition, in the manner in which it is written this legislation will impact many more individuals than just those utilizing trigger cranks and bump stocks. Banning an item, as proposed in this bill will not reduce violent crime, but will instead turn lawful Citizens into criminals with a stroke of a pen (and once again treat Marylanders as subjects not citizens). In addition, banning an item will NOT make the item disappear. For instance, murder is banned and yet Baltimore is striving to be the murder capital. Heroin is banned and yet there is a heroin epidemic.

    I will be tracking your your vote and I will be sure to spread the information in preparation to the elections this year since passage of these bills violates the oath you took when you assumed office.





    SEC. 9. Every person elected, or appointed, to any office of profit or trust, under this Constitution, or under the Laws, made pursuant thereto, shall, before he enters upon the duties of such office, take and subscribe the following oath, or affirmation: I, _______________, do swear, (or affirm, as the case may be,) that I will support the Constitution of the United States; and that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to the State of Maryland, and support the Constitution and Laws thereof; and that I will, to the best of my skill and judgment, diligently and faithfully, without partiality or prejudice, execute the office of________________, according to the Constitution and Laws of this State, (and, if a Governor, Senator, Member of the House of Delegates, or Judge,) that I will not directly or indirectly, receive the profits or any part of the profits of any other office during the term of my acting as___________ (originally Article I, sec. 6, renumbered by Chapter 681, Acts of 1977, ratified Nov. 7, 1978).



    Please direct your legislative energy to curbing the violence in Baltimore by addressing the criminal, not the tool. As in the testimony from the Baltimore City Police Chief (Acting), there has been not one legally owned forearm recovered as the result of a crime.

    Please vote against HB-0888, or SB-0707
     

    danb

    dont be a dumbass
    Feb 24, 2013
    22,704
    google is your friend, I am not.
    So here is the biggest problem with this law, it doesn’t have a grandfather clause, so anyone with an aftermarket trigger already in their gun is in violation.

    This said, if you build a gun yourself from a lower, what is the designed rate of fire? Essentially, you have designed the gun. This is especially true for an 80% lower.

    Right. Whats the standard rate of fire on an AR build.
     

    danb

    dont be a dumbass
    Feb 24, 2013
    22,704
    google is your friend, I am not.
    It sounds like they are going to pass it without considering the emmense amount of issues that will get dragged into and bascally let all the resulting action be settled in court cases down the road. If you can afford it......

    My guess, they simply won't enforce it. Bump stocks and cranks will be no bueno. Binary triggers marginal, likely banned. Maybe. Anything else, cant be enforced.

    Well get silly unenforceable proclamations from MSDP like we do now about "assault rifles", which are banned then not banned.
     

    danb

    dont be a dumbass
    Feb 24, 2013
    22,704
    google is your friend, I am not.
    The more I think about it, MDSPs non binding guidance will be the same as HBARs: If its marketed as a rapid fire device, its banned.

    As someone said upthread: Epic BGOS to follow, not much else.

    Companies will simply stop claiming their device speeds up fire.
     

    ziptiespec

    Active Member
    I take care of the newsletter for a small club ([url]http://marshyhoperodandgunclub.org/)[/URL] here on the Eastern Shore. I've been spreading the news about bills like this one in the club newsletter. I noted some other talking points that I'd like to offer others to use in their communication. Here's the full list that I included:

    • The Federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (BATFE) have previously reviewed the legality of bump stocks multiple times. Each time the devices have been found to comply with all Federal firearm statutes and are completely legal to own.
    • Federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (BATFE) have also reviewed the legality of other devices such as trigger cranks - these too have be found to comply with firearms laws and are completely legal to own.
    • Senate Bill 0707/House Bill 0888 is too broad in basing legality of certain devices on “standard rate of fire”, which can not be defined.
    • Senate Bill 0707/House Bill 0888, as worded, would make criminals out of lawful firearm owners that don’t even own bump stocks or trigger cranks.
    • Senate Bill 0707/House Bill 0888 have no grandfather clause and could potentially subject tens of thousands of law-abiding Maryland gun owners to prison time or hefty fines overnight.
    • Senate Bill 0707/House Bill 0888 will do nothing to stop crime.
     

    Bikebreath

    R.I.P.
    MDS Supporter
    Jun 30, 2009
    14,836
    in the bowels of Baltimore
    One thing that I noticed in section 4-306 of the bill was this sentence: "A person who uses an assault weapon, A RAPID FIRE TRIGGER ACTIVATOR,
    or a magazine that has a capacity of more than 10 rounds of ammunition..."

    Granted this talks about during the commission of a crime, but this is the first time that I have seen large magazines mentioned. Is this language currently in effect? Just showing my legal ignorance.

    I'll be corrected if I'm wrong; the capitalized wording are the the new parts, the parts that the bill is wishing to add/change.
     

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