C&R Bound book entry

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  • newq

    101st Poptart Assault BSB
    Mar 6, 2011
    1,593
    Eldersburg, MD
    I know that I have essentially 1 business day to enter a new acquisition into my bound book. However, What does the ATF consider the acquisition? Is it when I have payed for the firearm or is it when the firearm enters my possession?
     

    toolness1

    Ultimate Member
    Jan 5, 2014
    2,723
    BFE, Missouri
    I log them as the date I receive them in the mail, or buy them in person...

    I went back and redid my whole book because my first 15 or so, I was putting the purchase date instead of the date I received them.
     
    Jul 1, 2012
    5,736
    This is one case where more info might not necessarily hurt but may cause issues.

    Per ATF 478.125 "The record shall show the date of receipt" so recording both the purchase date and the date of receipt would be confusing at best and non-compliant with the required record-keeping at worst if audited. Maybe not a big deal but I wouldn't want to have to redo my book because of it. The required format just has "Date" not "Dates" :)

    I'm also firmly in the camp that "date of receipt" is when the firearm is actually, well, received.

    I use a second spreadsheet to record all the other details, like purchase date, price, estimated value, accessories that came with it, contact info for seller (email, phone, etc), condition, detailed description (markings and whatnot), all that good stuff. That spreadsheet is organized by type/mfg or whatever makes sense, not by acquisition date like the official ATF bound book. All that extra info shouldn't be in the bound book.
     

    Machodoc

    Old Guy
    Jun 27, 2012
    5,745
    Just South of Chuck County
    This is one case where more info might not necessarily hurt but may cause issues.

    Per ATF 478.125 "The record shall show the date of receipt" so recording both the purchase date and the date of receipt would be confusing at best and non-compliant with the required record-keeping at worst if audited. Maybe not a big deal but I wouldn't want to have to redo my book because of it. The required format just has "Date" not "Dates" :)

    I'm also firmly in the camp that "date of receipt" is when the firearm is actually, well, received.

    I use a second spreadsheet to record all the other details, like purchase date, price, estimated value, accessories that came with it, contact info for seller (email, phone, etc), condition, detailed description (markings and whatnot), all that good stuff. That spreadsheet is organized by type/mfg or whatever makes sense, not by acquisition date like the official ATF bound book. All that extra info shouldn't be in the bound book.

    ^^^^^ Perfect explanation and suggestions. Listen to this guy!
     

    CrazyIvan

    Crazy Ivan
    Aug 2, 2013
    158
    Scaggsville (Howard County)
    I log them the date I receive them (or within 24 hours). The problem is that for some online purchases (like AIM or Classic Firearms) you may not know the serial # of the gun you purchased until it arrives on the magic brown van.

    Cheers,
    Ivan
     
    Jul 1, 2012
    5,736
    CrazyIvan says ... you may not know the serial # of the gun you purchased until it arrives on the magic brown van.

    That's an excellent point too. And sometimes, the S/N isn't correctly listed on the invoice, listing, etc. Always log it as it appears on the firearm, not what the seller lists or says. Maybe that creates an issue down the line - for him. A classic example is WWII P.38s with 1-4 digit S/N and a letter block suffix (or prefix). Many sellers don't realize the letter is part of the actual S/N and leave it off. Another classic is Ballester-Molinas - the S/N is on the left side of frame at back of the grip (and underside of the slide), it's not the one on the right side of frame, slide, and barrel in large font - that's an issue or rack number ... I'm sure there's many other examples like this, but I digress ...
     
    Last edited:

    Machodoc

    Old Guy
    Jun 27, 2012
    5,745
    Just South of Chuck County
    Another classic is Ballester-Molinas - the S/N is on the left side of frame at back of the grip (and underside of the slide), it's not the one on the right side of frame, slide, and barrel in large font - that's an issue or rack number.

    I wonder how many BATFE field agents realize that? That's one of the few cases where I entered both sets of numbers in my Bound Book. The others were when the LGS entered a number that was on the firearm, but not the number put on it by the importer.

    I can always cross one off, but I can't remember one down the road.
     

    mawkie

    C&R Whisperer
    Sep 28, 2007
    4,356
    Catonsville
    Same holds true for Finn MNs that have both a production SN and Civil Guard numbers. Easy for a seller to get them confused if they aren't familiar with Finn arms.
    And you sometimes get acquisitions where the seller can't find the SN. Savage auto pistols and their Model 19 rifle are two examples where they placed the SN on an edge of the receiver and frame, making it difficult to find if you don't know where to look for it.
    I always log date that it enters my possession as I've had instances where a purchase took a month or more to arrive. Plus, as mentioned, you want to be able to log ID info accurately.
     

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