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Old December 8th, 2016, 12:37 PM #41
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exactly. belive me you filled one out.
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Old December 8th, 2016, 12:39 PM #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PapiBarcelona View Post
You don't get copies of the 4473, the gun dealer keeps the the only copy that you fill out.

Federal:

4473 is the white paper you fill personal info in, Yes/No to a bunch of questions and open up and sign inside.


Maryland:

77r is yes/no with initials. Multiple pages of Pink

The mental health is the other white one side piece of paper you fill personal info on.
Like I said, "I" have not filled one of these out...they must do it, and I sign it...I looked on ATF site to see what it looked like.

I see your point now, about 2 trips...maybe the same FFL's who have always filled mine out in the past, will still do it? Making only 1 trip needed?

Regardless, I am picking a new gun Monday, and possibly another BEFORE 12/31, and then will sit back and watch the show. I want mine bought and home BEFORE 1/1/17
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Old December 8th, 2016, 12:43 PM #43
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here is a copy for you
.
Attached Images
File Type: pdf atf-f-4473-1.pdf (71.6 KB, 70 views)
File Type: pdf atf-f-4473-2 (Form 4473 - Part II).pdf (42.9 KB, 54 views)
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Old December 8th, 2016, 04:53 PM #44
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Hopefully, we've got a good legal team lined up for when this whole mess fails to work. Software is hard, and the state of Maryland has a very poor record with anything software-related.
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Old December 9th, 2016, 09:20 AM #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 71Chevelle427 View Post
Like I said, "I" have not filled one of these out...they must do it, and I sign it...I looked on ATF site to see what it looked like.

I see your point now, about 2 trips...maybe the same FFL's who have always filled mine out in the past, will still do it? Making only 1 trip needed?

Regardless, I am picking a new gun Monday, and possibly another BEFORE 12/31, and then will sit back and watch the show. I want mine bought and home BEFORE 1/1/17
Not doubting you.

It's kind of surprising to me. There's obviously a few places for the FFL to fill out info as the transferor but I wonder what's up with an FFL filing out all the buyers personal info and Yes/No questions?

I mean the first Yes/No question on the 4473 is something like "Are you the actual buyer of this firearm(s) ....."

If your FFL is answering it? Let me adjust my tinfoil a little.
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Old December 9th, 2016, 09:36 AM #46
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If you go to a dealer who is willing to release according to Maryland law, this will have no effect on the buyer. After the mandatory waiting period has elapsed, go get your gun. If the MSP computer is locked up for a year, who cares?
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Old December 9th, 2016, 10:25 AM #47
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The block above the signature on the 4473 starts with:

Quote:
I certify that my answers to Section A are true, correct, and complete.
If you did not answer the questions yourself, then you are lying by signing it.

It goes on to say that making a false oral or written statement is a Federal felony.

I REALLY hope you have been misremembering about filling out the 4473.
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Old December 10th, 2016, 12:21 PM #48
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So......I went back to OP's (Swinokur) posting of the MSP announcement. Seems to me that this whole thing is directed to FFL dealers only.
They must provide their eMail address, etc etc. and I guess will be required to use the On-Line system to forward "Buyers" data.

I see nothing about "buyers" account, or signing up, etc etc. I see that MSP will no longer accept hard copy paperwork for Background investigations.

Guess I just don't see how this is going to work from a "Buyers" point of view.

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Old December 10th, 2016, 12:26 PM #49
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Old December 10th, 2016, 12:27 PM #50
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Old December 11th, 2016, 08:25 AM #51
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They do not think anyone owning a firearm is mentally stable. They think we are all nuts to the core.
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Old December 13th, 2016, 02:01 PM #52
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I have yet to see (or did I miss it) what is going to happen for individual transfers at an MSP barracks?
Are they going to drag out a laptop?
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Old December 13th, 2016, 04:17 PM #53
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According to a post in a similar thread, the barracks will use the same system. They have desktops.

https://www.mdshooters.com/showthrea...73#post4610573
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Old December 13th, 2016, 04:31 PM #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swinokur View Post
According to a post in a similar thread, the barracks will use the same system. They have desktops.

https://www.mdshooters.com/showthrea...73#post4610573
I would think they would have to put a dedicated terminal in the lobby. I can't see them allowing some unknown 1) to access a secure area and 2) to use a computer that has MILES and NCIS on it.
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Old December 13th, 2016, 04:33 PM #55
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NCIS would be on a TV.

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Old December 13th, 2016, 10:28 PM #56
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MSP 77r e-portal goes live 1-1-17

This 77Re may take a while to understand. But it's not super complicated. The MSP invited me to one of their dealer training seminars recently. I was thoroughly impressed with the work that has gone into this. The buying of a handgun in Maryland is one of the most complicated puzzles I have ever seen. I asked a ton of questions. I was satisfied with every answer. This is not the typical database you would see from a state agency. It is up and ready to go now. The MSP delayed the start because they didn't want dealers to have to learn a new system while managing the usual increased Christmas sales. January was an easier time for the dealers. I think people will be generally happy with the finished product. Not everyone will like it. Yes, you the buyer, will need an email address. You will be able to create an online account. You the buyer will be able to check your account after the dealer has submitted the application and you can check the progress of the application. I see this as the step we need to rid those of the 7 day wait. If you already have an hql or you already own a firearm and the msp can do a check within 10 minutes after receipt of the application, then why would you need a "cooling off period?" The 9th circuit over turned a 10 day wait for the same thing. Also, federal law allows for a state with an HQl to waive the nics check. You could buy a gun with just an hql only if MD used this system to its full potential. But you would have to convince a legislature filled with Democrats to make that change. But it could save millions of dollars in manpower.


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Old December 13th, 2016, 10:33 PM #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack McCauley View Post
This 77Re may take a while to understand. But it's not super complicated. The MSP invited me to one of their dealer training seminars recently. I was thoroughly impressed with the work that has gone into this. The buying of a handgun in Maryland is one of the most complicated puzzles I have ever seen. I asked a ton of questions. I was satisfied with every answer. This is not the typical database you would see from a state agency. It is up and ready to go now. The MSP delayed the start because they didn't want dealers to have to learn a new system while managing the usual increased Christmas sales. January was an easier time for the dealers. I think people will be generally happy with the finished product. Not everyone will like it. Yes, you the buyer, will need an email address. You will be able to create an online account. You the buyer will be able to check your account after the dealer has submitted the application and you can check the progress of the application. I see this as the step we need to rid those of the 7 day wait. If you already have an hql or you already own a firearm and the msp can do a check within 10 minutes after receipt of the application, then why would you need a "cooling off period?" The 9th circuit over turned a 10 day wait for the same thing. Also, federal law allows for a state with an HQl to waive the nics check. You could buy a gun with just an hql only if MD used this system to its full potential. But you would have to convince a legislature filled with Democrats to make that change. But it could save millions of dollars in manpower.


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Old December 14th, 2016, 12:12 PM #58
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So, this will effect anyone who will be buying a handgun or lower after 1 Jan 2017. Buyer will log into MSP web sight to start 77r. You provide info for the same parts of forms you fill out today. You will need a valid email address. Once you complete your part of form you will get a code emailed to you. You bring that code to FFL. FFL will open application and auto populate 77r form with pulled down info from your data (FFL will use that code you were emailed). FFL qa's answers and corrects some items if needed. Ex wrong choice in sales type... FFL adds in info on weapon being bought and other info FFL normally enters on 77r. FFL then turns computer over to you to pay $10.00 MSP fee. You will need a credit card for that or some arrangement with FFL if you don't have a credit card. FFL submits 77r electronically and if all goes well you pick up weapon after 7 day waiting period like normal

Take aways:
- buyer starts process online
- buyer needs email address
- buyer pays MSP 10.00 fee directly and then what ever FFL charges for transfer direct to FFL given buying situation.

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Old December 14th, 2016, 12:29 PM #59
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I am just so happy that EVERYONE in Maryland has a credit card and a computer...



P.S... I think I used my maximum allotted amount of sarcasm for the week... on the above statement...
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Old December 14th, 2016, 12:30 PM #60
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Do you need an Email Address to Vote?

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