HB1302-"The Neighborhood Bag Lady Can Take Your Guns" bill

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  • inkd

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 4, 2009
    7,543
    Ridge
    I was wondering if any PP or pro 2a people went to the 2nd town hall today i also was going to go it would have been my third or forth town hall for showing my support for her but after her turn coat antics Im pissed at myself for being sucked in by her bs over the past year and a half

    That's at least 2 people that didn't go. I'd like to think there were more.
     

    East2West

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Jul 20, 2013
    902
    Nomalley, Nobama
    Afzali praising herself as a pro 2a delegate...... BS.

    I told her she sold us out on HB888 and HB1302, she said I'm entitled to my opinion....


    https://app.robly.com/archive?id=86f388a37f60e68eb6bd8c0bea0f83f6&v=true


    She blocked me from being able to comment on her page. Guess she's not a fan of people posting the NRA's message about pressuring voters to oppose 1302, despite her claims they support it. This type of treason cannot go unpunished. EACH AND EVERY ONE OF THESE TRAITORS NEEDS TO BE PRIMARIED.
     

    j_h_smith

    Ultimate Member
    Jul 28, 2007
    28,516
    She blocked me from being able to comment on her page. Guess she's not a fan of people posting the NRA's message about pressuring voters to oppose 1302, despite her claims they support it. This type of treason cannot go unpunished. EACH AND EVERY ONE OF THESE TRAITORS NEEDS TO BE PRIMARIED FIRED NOW.

    Fixed it for ya.
     

    HRDWRK

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    Jan 7, 2013
    2,661
    39°43′19.92216″ N
    I received this reply from Delegate Nick Kipke today.

    I have an A+ grade from the NRA and endorsed every election because I always vote pro Second Amendment.

    Like you, and like most Americans, I am deeply concerned about keeping our children and families safe in our schools and communities. In the wake of the horrific shooting in a Florida school earlier this year, there has been a renewed call in the media for increased gun control. Although I would do anything in my power to keep such a terrible event from happening again, I have never believed that more gun control is the answer. I don’t believe in punishing law-abiding Americans for the evil acts of a deranged few.

    As you and I both know, there are other, better ways to ensure the safety of our children and families without infringing on the rights of the law-abiding gun owners in our country. In Maryland and in Anne Arundel County, County Executive Steve Schuh and Governor Larry Hogan are putting forward the necessary resources to have armed School Resource Officers at our schools, installing metal detectors, securing entryways, ensuring law enforcement has access to real-time video and communications, and much more.

    In addition to funding for these important projects, there are several other proposals being considered that will if enacted reduce violent crime. For example, creating mandatory minimum jail sentences for repeat criminals. Something that I think will help to target violent individuals while not affecting law-abiding citizens is the concept of an “Extreme Risk Prevention Order,” or ERPO if done properly. This would allow a judge to create a scenario in which an individual who is shown to present an immediate and present danger to himself or others is temporarily denied access to the means of causing that harm. This concept is supported by the National Rifle Association.

    In many of the most recent school shootings, the shooter has shown warning signs for months leading up to a shooting. Often in the weeks and months following a tragedy, it comes out that the mother or friend or teacher knew the young man was dangerous, knew he was planning something, and was helpless to stop him. The ERPO provides a mechanism by which those people can get help for their loved ones while ensuring that they do not harm themselves or others.

    House Bill 1302 – Public Safety Extreme Risk Prevention Orders creates that scenario. Anyone who petitions the court to issue such an order must reach certain evidentiary standards, and the order lasts for up to one year – it is not a permanent suspension of a person’s rights. I have heard from many people around the state with concerns about this specific bill, and while I wholeheartedly support the intent of the bill, I’ve found that upon closer reading and understanding of the actual content of this bill, I share many of those concerns and have some of my own.

    When HB 1302 reached the House floor for the first vote no organization had opposed it. Still I offered several amendments which would have strengthened the punishment for people using this serious mechanism inappropriately, such as a dispute between neighbors or in a vindictive situation, but those proposals were rejected and I was told that those legal protections were already covered in the bill. However, in the days since this bill initially passed the house, I’ve learned that the bill as written does not allow for due process and contains a number of other concerning elements. This bill still needs to make its way through the Senate, and I’m optimistic that the necessary changes will be made during that process. If not, as much as I support the concept, I won’t be able to vote for the bill as it stands for final passage.

    The following are changes that have been proposed to improve the bill. If these changes are not made, I intend to vote against the bill on final passage.

    • Requiring stronger criminal penalties for those who bring false and frivolous charges.
    • Requiring that an order only be granted when a judge makes a CLEAR and CONVINCING DETERMINATION that the person poses a significant risk of danger to himself or others.
    • Requiring that in the process of issuing the order, the judge determine if the individual meets the state standard for involuntary commitment. If they meet the standard, they should be involuntarily committed. This addresses the need for these individuals to undergo treatment.
    • Requiring that any ex parte proceeding should include admitting the individual for treatment.
    • Requiring that there be a mechanism in place for the return of firearms upon termination of the ERPO.
    • Requiring that the process allow the individual to challenge or terminate the order, with full due process protections in place.
    • Requiring that the process allow firearms to be retained by law-abiding third parties, local law enforcement, or a federally licensed firearms dealer when an individual is ordered to relinquish such firearms as a condition of the ERPO. The individual must also have the ability to sell his or her firearms in a reasonable time without violating the order.

    If you have any additional concerns about the bill that you would like to address please do not hesitate to let me know.

    Sincerely,
    Nic Kipke


    I received this from Kathy yesterday!


    As you may know I am an A-ranked NRA legislator.
    Link to ranking
    ​​​​​​​
    In the eight years that I have served as your delegate, I have co-sponsored more than 50 pro-gun pieces of legislation and voted against the gun-grabbing left to fight for your rights as a gun owner. I am a lifetime NRA member and believe the Constitution guarantees me the right to protect my family.

    Recently one of my opponents in the Frederick County Executive race has used an illegal Facebook Page to distort my record for political gain. I am here to set the record straight.

    HB1302
    Link to the bill

    This year in Annapolis most NRA-ranked Republicans voted for a bill that many, including President Trump, V.P. Pence, and Governor Hogan believe is common sense. The bill is called Public Safety - Extreme Risk Prevention Orders or the "Red Flag" bill.

    The bill allows firearms to be removed from the possession of a person who has demonstrated extreme risk to themselves or another. The bill establishes due process and will give law enforcement a tool they need to prevent an unthinkably violent act. I stand by my vote.

    If we want to protect our Second Amendment rights, we cannot pretend there aren't those among us who should NOT have access to a firearm. The mentally ill cannot be armed!

    To the left are some of the pro-gun pieces of legislation that I have co-sponsored over the past eight years. To say that I am pro-Second Amendment is an understatement.

    In your service,
    Kathy Afzali
    Delegate &
    Candidate for Frederick County Executive
     

    Rack&Roll

    R.I.P
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 23, 2013
    22,304
    Bunkerville, MD
    I have a very long post coming up to dissect what they are doing and trying to do with the Red Flag Bill, HB1302.

    Tonight, though, I have my hands full with some other things, but I have time to say this: we must get in front of EVERY Maryland state legislator this upcoming week with this one message: A VOTE FOR THE RED FLAG BILL IS A VOTE FOR THE UNTHINKABLE--A VOTE IN 2018 TO VIOLATE BASIC CIVIL RIGHTS.

    It's time notify to every Maryland legislator, Democrat or Republican, that we will make damn sure their voters and their opponents at the primary level and at the General Election level know they voted for a Red Flag Bill that strips the Bill of Rights from Maryland homes. Voting for a Maryland law that overrides the 4th Amendment of the Constitution is treasonous.

    Our position is no more complicated than that. Reach every Democrat and Republican you can, and tell them we will flood their mailboxes and social media to define them as Quislings who are willing sell Civil Rights down the river to pretend they are being effective.

    ENOUGH!

    On Monday, when the legislators cross in front of us in the Patriot Picket from their offices to the Statehouse, we will have more hard-hitting signs accusing all of them of doing the unthinkable--undercutting Civil Rights in the modern age. We will say this as many times as it takes: "We will help ANY AND ALL of your opponents, Democrat or Republican, to defeat you at the ballot box to end this cancer of violating basic Civil Rights in Maryland."
     

    Rack&Roll

    R.I.P
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 23, 2013
    22,304
    Bunkerville, MD
    Please consider joining the Patriot Picket tomorrow night at 7pm at Lawyer’s Mall with your own sign.

    Rig up your own sign or hold one of ours. The message is: “A vote for the Red Flag Bill threatens your re-election.”

    RED FLAG BILL =
    CIVIL RIGHTS GONE!
    BYE-BYE RE-ELECTION!

    RED FLAG ALERT:
    VIOLATE 4th AMDT
    & YOU ARE GONE!

    RED FLAG BILL:
    TAKE OUR RIGHTS
    & LOSE YOUR JOB!

    MD POLITICIANS:
    GUT CIVIL RIGHTS
    AT YOUR PERIL!

    RED FLAG BILL:
    SOVIET SYSTEM =
    2018 VOTER REVOLT
     

    Rack&Roll

    R.I.P
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 23, 2013
    22,304
    Bunkerville, MD
    We need five more new folks tomorrow night for one of the Patriot Picket’s most important Monday Nights Of 2018.

    This is one of our last chances to tell the both the Democrats and Republicans that we will work for any candidates running against them this Fall if they vote to violate our 4th Amendment Rights with the Red Flag legislation!

    Both the House and Senate are crossing the street from their offices to the Statehouse during the same hour--7-8pm. As always we will have a crew eating at Mission BBQ, City Dock, from 6 to 6:50pm.

    Right now, the Senate Judicial Proceedings Committee will meet at 5pm to discuss all the backflips they are trying to accomplish to get around the fact that this Red Flag bill STILL VIOLATES EVERY MARYLANDER'S CIVIL RIGHTS as written.

    The sickening thing is that the Senate Democrats have turned the drafting of this Red Flag bill over to the ANTI-GUN "Everytown For Gun Safety" group--proof that this bill in not about safety but about separating firearms from their owners FOR GOOD.

    They know the "any interested person" clause for making accusations is toxic, and they have heard repeatedly from Mark Pennak of "Maryland Shall Issue" that their dream scheme--no matter which way they juggle the elements of the plan to deal with people who don't have a mental illness--cannot overcome violations to every American's 4th Amendment rights!

    As noted by PCfixer: "Mark Pennak, MSI president and attorney put forth that under the 4th Amendment, probable cause, and "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation..." .... there must be evidence of a crime committed or going to be committed... His words not mine. But makes sense. Search and seizure can't be constitutional just because someone thinks or a judge thinks your an 'extreme risk to cause harm""

    Being irritated, grumpy, moody, pissed off, or cranky is NOT grounds to deprive any of us of our 4th Amendment rights.

    We need to unify on this to let both Democrats and Republicans know that a vote for a Red Flag bill that criminalizes cranky or grumpy utterances from people who happen to own firearms will NOT BE TOLERATED, and that we will contact every candidate running against a Democrat or Republican to remind them of the incumbents who voted to gut our rights.
     

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    Rack&Roll

    R.I.P
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 23, 2013
    22,304
    Bunkerville, MD
    Is that 5pm committee mtg open to the public?

    On Friday, the Senate JPR committee chair person announced a committee meeting at 5pm tomorrow (Monday), so we have every expectation that we may attend and observe--as stipulated by the MD Open Meetings Law.

    I invite anyone who wants to sit in the Senate Judicial Proceedings Committee--as Deep Lurker and I did many days last week--to come to Annapolis before 5pm for what is understood to be a "voting session".

    The phrase "voting session" is used when the legislators gather as a committee to discuss a bill, although not every session includes a vote--but it always includes discussion, and mark-up of bill they are considering.
     

    Rack&Roll

    R.I.P
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 23, 2013
    22,304
    Bunkerville, MD
    I goofed on the posted time up in our Call To Action post, above.

    Those who want to eat with our regular crew at Mission BBQ, City Dock, before we Hit The Bricks...we get together from 6-6:50pm.
     

    Stoveman

    TV Personality
    Patriot Picket
    Sep 2, 2013
    28,431
    Cuba on the Chesapeake
    I goofed on the posted time up in our Call To Action post, above.

    Those who want to eat with our regular crew at Mission BBQ, City Dock, before we Hit The Bricks...we get together from 6-6:50pm.



    Thank God, I thought that the Notorious AOB had lobbied for an additional hour at BBQ land. ;)
     

    Rack&Roll

    R.I.P
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 23, 2013
    22,304
    Bunkerville, MD
    Also, please, for anyone who is uncomfortable holding a sign, would you still attend our Sidewalk Testimony Hour at Lawyer's Mall next to the Statehouse from 7-8pm?

    It is a chance to chat briefly with the legislators in your district, and any others who you think would benefit from your observations. However, even if this Joe SixPack lobbying is intimidating, just join us anyway to stand with others in this noble effort to move the needle.

    Frankly, the more the merrier.

    The bigger the presence we have, the greater our impact.
     

    BeoBill

    Crank in the Third Row
    MDS Supporter
    Oct 3, 2013
    27,201
    南馬里蘭州鮑伊

    Adolph Oliver Bush

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Dec 13, 2015
    1,940
    Thank God, I thought that the Notorious AOB had lobbied for an additional hour at BBQ land. ;)

    Would be more fun to hit 5pm meeting so I can chortle and guffaw at stupid comments, even if I can't testify. Might sneak in some carryout......

    Regardless, I'll be in front of the legiscritters somewhere in Annapolis tonight.
     

    smkranz

    Certified Caveman
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 21, 2013
    4,391
    Carroll County
    I just received a voice message from Sen. Ready whom I had emailed about today’s Judicial Proceedings Committee meeting. Sorry that I couldn’t take the call when it came in, cuz he left a lengthy and substantive message. I won’t share the whole thing verbatim, but essentially he said today’s meeting is among a “working group” of several senators, and groups including the NRA, anti’s, and mental health interests, who are working on the bill. No testimony will be taken, but people are welcome to attend. He obviously will not support the bill as written but there are several amendments pending which hopefully will remove and/or address the more troubling aspects of the bill including the due process/4th Amendment issues. He also believes that current law already could adequately address some of the things the bill tries to accomplish.

    I’m hoping to be able to get there early enough to attend this meeting, and/or Mission BBQ, but work and distance are conspiring against me. In any event I’ll be on the sidewalk by 7:00.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    Adolph Oliver Bush

    Ultimate Member
    Patriot Picket
    Dec 13, 2015
    1,940
    Not seeing anything on the schedule for judicial proceedings today.

    Are they meeting at the usual location where rights are trampled, and the state and federal Constitutions are ignored?
     

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