BUMP STOCK SUIT FILED!

clandestine · Oct 4, 2018

Occam said:
Today, via plain ol' USPS postal mail, I received a hardcopy of the ATF's usual boilerplate about the MD law (right off the web site), and: MY ORIGINAL SIGNED LETTER, returned to me with a nice big red stamped "RETURN WITHOUT ACTION" on it. Which reminds me of a notable bar outing in college, but that's another story.

I think they got that stamp from the same place that makes them for the Maryland State Police.

"Not disapproved"

Jim12 · Oct 4, 2018

cantstop said:
This law sucks. It is purposely vague.

If someone like Ben Jealous becomes Governor it will certainly be abused as we all fear.

Vague criminal laws violate Due Process - theoretically. We've all just seen what the US Senate Judiciary Committee's Democrats - of ALL people -- think of due process, thanks to the Kav hearings. Disgraceful and anti-American.

They want federal judges who think like they do.

bbrown · Oct 4, 2018

Occam said:
Today, via plain ol' USPS postal mail, I received a hardcopy of the ATF's usual boilerplate about the MD law (right off the web site), and: MY ORIGINAL SIGNED LETTER, returned to me with a nice big red stamped "RETURN WITHOUT ACTION" on it.

Yup, mine arrived today as well.

Interestingly, my letter has a date stamped on it (9/27) and a hand-written number (185xxx).

ironpony · Oct 4, 2018

bbrown said:
Yup, mine arrived today as well.

Interestingly, my letter has a date stamped on it (9/27) and a hand-written number (185xxx).

They'd be fools not to keep a list ... from a .gov perspective, in case of an oil shortage that is.

mac1_131 · Oct 4, 2018

Hawkeye said:
That is false.

There is literally no way for the state of MD to know about non-regulated gun purchases. They involve no state paperwork at all, and no contact with any state agency.

So unless the MSP or someone is going around to every gun store in the state and making copies of all of the 4473s that the FFL keeps, it's just impossible. In fact, I don't even think that they'd have any legal ability to do that.

FSA 2013 absolutely gave them the legal ability to do that.

Having said that, I sort of doubt they are routinely doing that. Our IPs could tell us if the were.

But they can.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

Hawkeye · Oct 4, 2018

mac1_131 said:
FSA 2013 absolutely gave them the legal ability to do that.

To do what? Go around and make copies of every 4473 that's filled out at every FFL in the state? Because that's the only way I could think of for them to have those records. And that is NOT in FSA2013, nor could it be. The state can't pass a law that gives themselves access to federal records.

whistlersmother · Oct 4, 2018

Hey! Hey! Hey! Got my application back from ATF stamped "RETURN WITHOUT ACTION". They even included the advisory about the Maryland law. From the NFA branch no less - somehow I don't feel special...

My gun oil is safe until 10/1/2019.

44man · Oct 4, 2018

Hawkeye said:
That is false.

There is literally no way for the state of MD to know about non-regulated gun purchases. They involve no state paperwork at all, and no contact with any state agency.

So unless the MSP or someone is going around to every gun store in the state and making copies of all of the 4473s that the FFL keeps, it's just impossible. In fact, I don't even think that they'd have any legal ability to do that.

Well I believe it was valerio, so, that said they had records of them and when pressed about it and how and why his answer was basically don’t worry about how and that they really didn’t care that we knew. He was asked if it was regulated and he said all guns with paperwork

You can go back and try and find the video but it’s been talked about on here several times before

mac1_131 · Oct 4, 2018

Hawkeye said:
To do what? Go around and make copies of every 4473 that's filled out at every FFL in the state? Because that's the only way I could think of for them to have those records. And that is NOT in FSA2013, nor could it be. The state can't pass a law that gives themselves access to federal records.

1) WHEN REQUIRED BY A LETTER ISSUED BY THE SECRETARY, A

29 LICENSEE SHALL SUBMIT TO THE SECRETARY THE INFORMATION REQUIRED TO

30 BE KEPT UNDER SUBSECTION (A) OF THIS SECTION FOR THE TIME PERIODS

31 SPECIFIED BY THE SECRETARY.

Applies to Maryland licensed dealers. Says all firearms, not just regulated firearms.

So yes they can go Xerox the ATF book of any maryland regulated firearms dealer if they want to.

Probably can't do this to the few FFLs left that aren't MRFDs but there aren't that many of those left.

Will they/do they do this? Who knows but they can.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

basscat · Oct 4, 2018

The government would never lie to us. :innocent0

Maswasnos · Oct 4, 2018

Just got my mailed response from the ATF, they were kind enough to send it back with a stamp and a date so that I've got proof of "applying":

I'm covered for another year, so go get 'em MSI!

Bountied · Oct 5, 2018

I got the same response as in the letter above only in an email and they don't have my home address.

RemRod · Oct 5, 2018

Just got my rejected let yesterday

Bob A · Oct 5, 2018

My return receipt has been "in transit to next facility" ever since it arrived in DC on 9/26.

Ten days and counting to get a postcard to transit six miles.

Sundazes · Oct 5, 2018

Bob A said:
My return receipt has been "in transit to next facility" ever since it arrived in DC on 9/26.

Ten days and counting to get a postcard to transit six miles.

It's not the distance, it's the process it has to go through...

Jake4U · Oct 5, 2018

Got my reject letter today.

ironpony · Oct 5, 2018

Is "Rejected" different than "No Action"? I have not received mine yet.

esqappellate · Oct 5, 2018

Maswasnos said:
Just got my mailed response from the ATF, they were kind enough to send it back with a stamp and a date so that I've got proof of "applying":

I'm covered for another year, so go get 'em MSI!

Everyone should hold onto those returned letters from the ATF. That's your proof that you "applied" under the grandfather provisions of SB 707. I think it is *GREAT* that the ATF is taking the time and money to send them back to you. They are basically doing something that proves your defense to prosecution under this bump stock law. Kudos to the ATF. They did not have to do that.

Kicken Wing · Oct 5, 2018

I just received my application returned today as well. Mine is stamped Sep. 27, 2018 "Return without action" just like some of the others I see here. I have yet to receive my green certified card from USPS but that does not matter at this point. I have been rejected! So it took 18 days from the time that I mailed it to the time I received it.

whistlersmother · Oct 5, 2018

I wonder, if BAFTE rules bumpstocks are illegal machine guns (oh, brother), I'll be contacted since I sent in a letter. I can rejoice in the disappointment of some BAFTE agent when I tell them I sent in the application to protect my gun oil... :lol2:

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