SB 39

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

  • No ad networks!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,407
    So I have read this bill a few times. Admittedly, I am a dummy but cant quite figure out what they are doing with this one. Would this ban all anderson's regardless of hbar or not? ALL 300's or just anderson 300's? I am a little lost on this one. Either way, it needs to go down in flames but I am just trying to understand what it targets.

    Thanks

    It purports to ban Anderson Manufacturing AM-15 in the .223 and the .300Blk calibers. The AM 15 is already banned as a copy of the Colt AR 15, so the only thing it actually does is ban the AM -15 in the .300 Blackout. Which of course hardly ever been used in a crime. A lot of ignorance in this bill.
     
    Last edited:

    shershot99

    Active Member
    Mar 22, 2010
    334
    Carroll County
    It purports to ban Anderson Manufacturing AM-15 in the .223 and the .300Blk calibers. The AM 15 is already banned as a copy of the Colt AR 15, so the only thing it actually does is ban the AM -15 in the .300 Blackout. Which of course hardly ever been has used in a crime. A lot of ignorance in this bill.

    Yes you are correct on that. So if you "built" a 300blk hunting set up and happened to use an anderson lower vs say another brand like aero, etc.. would that then be banned? Legal if you used aero or other lower? I am really starting to think about moving to Alaska...
     

    esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,407
    Yes you are correct on that. So if you "built" a 300blk hunting set up and happened to use an anderson lower vs say another brand like aero, etc.. would that then be banned? Legal if you used aero or other lower? I am really starting to think about moving to Alaska...

    You have just illustrated the absurdity of the matter. So yes, if you build a .300blk using an Anderson lower, it would probably be banned as a "copy" under MD Code Public Safety 5-101(r)(2). So if you use a different lower it MAY be fine, as the .300blk round long gun is otherwise not on the (r)(2) list. But, it is hard to be definitive.
     

    Kharn

    Ultimate Member
    Mar 9, 2008
    3,578
    Hazzard County
    So what is the current status of AM15 lowers since they're listed as banned as a copy? Can they only be used for pistols, or can they also be used for HBAR builds?
     

    shershot99

    Active Member
    Mar 22, 2010
    334
    Carroll County
    So what is the current status of AM15 lowers since they're listed as banned as a copy? Can they only be used for pistols, or can they also be used for HBAR builds?



    My understanding is they can be used as hbar or pistol but I’m not a lawyer. My understanding better be correct though.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    Stagstalker

    Active Member
    Jan 15, 2017
    159
    The cesspool of MD
    They likely came here and saw disparaging remarks and saw those that owned 300bo, a little revenge, alittle infringement, a little terrorizing...all good fun to them. Anderson because its widely used because its reasonably priced, that cuts a wide swath threw the populous. An FOIA to each legislator would be very interesting, would likely reveal a conspiracy to violate civil liberties. VCDL found good stuff with their FOIA. Better late than never.
     

    rbird7282

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 6, 2012
    18,530
    Columbia
    They likely came here and saw disparaging remarks and saw those that owned 300bo, a little revenge, alittle infringement, a little terrorizing...all good fun to them. Anderson because its widely used because its reasonably priced, that cuts a wide swath threw the populous. An FOIA to each legislator would be very interesting, would likely reveal a conspiracy to violate civil liberties. VCDL found good stuff with their FOIA. Better late than never.



    No, Frosh was behind this one guaranteed.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     

    calicojack

    American Sporting Rifle
    MDS Supporter
    May 29, 2018
    5,348
    Cuba on the Chesapeake
    So I am wondering if this is all about making the average Joe think that their local government "saved" them by banning the Dayton mass murder gun in Maryland; doesn't matter if they actually did or not. Only the perception matters. My two cents.
     

    shershot99

    Active Member
    Mar 22, 2010
    334
    Carroll County
    Has anyone gotten any readout about how this went yesterday or where this bill stands? I know its only been one day but I am curious as to what people think. It seems the long gun bill cant be stopped (from what I hear) but I am hoping this one is done, cause it should be.

    Thoughts?
     

    teratos

    My hair is amazing
    MDS Supporter
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 22, 2009
    59,775
    Bel Air
    Has anyone gotten any readout about how this went yesterday or where this bill stands? I know its only been one day but I am curious as to what people think. It seems the long gun bill cant be stopped (from what I hear) but I am hoping this one is done, cause it should be.

    Thoughts?

    Prediction. They will ram everything through basically unchanged. Why? They can and they REALLY hold us in contempt.
     

    esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,407
    Prediction. They will ram everything through basically unchanged. Why? They can and they REALLY hold us in contempt.

    Actually, I was at that hearing. I got the impression that the Committee thought that the bill has some problems. The sponsor himself said he would insert a grandfather clause, to avoid the retroactive taking issue.
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    13,866
    Rockville, MD
    Actually, I was at that hearing. I got the impression that the Committee thought that the bill has some problems. The sponsor himself said he would insert a grandfather clause, to avoid the retroactive taking issue.
    So what I'm hearing is: "stock up on Anderson lowers because the state is being kind enough to give us a way to get non-HBAR ARs this year". Sweet.
     

    teratos

    My hair is amazing
    MDS Supporter
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 22, 2009
    59,775
    Bel Air
    Actually, I was at that hearing. I got the impression that the Committee thought that the bill has some problems. The sponsor himself said he would insert a grandfather clause, to avoid the retroactive taking issue.

    They are not, however, doing that out of the goodness of their hearts. They are doing that because they see how leaving that in would make their “law” easier to overturn. The bone they throw us makes the bill stronger.

    Thanks for being there. I can’t get off work without “common sense” notice.
     

    esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,407
    So what I'm hearing is: "stock up on Anderson lowers because the state is being kind enough to give us a way to get non-HBAR ARs this year". Sweet.

    Well, no. The Anderson .223 is already banned as a copy of the Colt AR 15, so you can't build that. You could build a heavy barrel.
     

    shershot99

    Active Member
    Mar 22, 2010
    334
    Carroll County
    Well, no. The Anderson .223 is already banned as a copy of the Colt AR 15, so you can't build that. You could build a heavy barrel.

    Ok. I guess this is a victory... however small. As I know someone with SEVERAL andy builds in various calibers (All HBARs of course). I just hate having to see something like this as a victory. We really need a major SCOTUS ruling soon... if not several. I hate that they left so much up for interpretation in Heller (I am not a lawyer so that is just my opinion). Hopefully we can defeat it all-together or run out the clock maybe.
     

    erwos

    The Hebrew Hammer
    MDS Supporter
    Mar 25, 2009
    13,866
    Rockville, MD
    Well, no. The Anderson .223 is already banned as a copy of the Colt AR 15, so you can't build that. You could build a heavy barrel.
    Depends on whether the MSP recognizes an HBAR exception to the Anderson lowers if the bill passes. They've proven themselves to be the masters of bizarre interpretations in the past (see: Bushmaster). By definition, no grandfathering would be required if they were already banned, right?

    Let me clarify: you buy an Anderson lower, and build out an HBAR on it. This bill passes. Your Anderson HBAR is now prohibited according to MSP interpretation. However, now that it's prohibited, there is nothing stopping you from slapping a normal barrel on it, because that has no impact on its status. It is a copy either way. I don't see how I'm getting this wrong.
     

    esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,407
    Depends on whether the MSP recognizes an HBAR exception to the Anderson lowers if the bill passes. They've proven themselves to be the masters of bizarre interpretations in the past (see: Bushmaster). By definition, no grandfathering would be required if they were already banned, right?

    Let me clarify: you buy an Anderson lower, and build out an HBAR on it. This bill passes. Your Anderson HBAR is now prohibited according to MSP interpretation. However, now that it's prohibited, there is nothing stopping you from slapping a normal barrel on it, because that has no impact on its status. It is a copy either way. I don't see how I'm getting this wrong.

    Not sure that would be true, although it is hard to tell for sure. The question would be whether the ban on the Anderson Am-15 in .223 and .300blk would ban using that receiver to custom build a heavy barrel version. The Anderson AM-15 in .223 is already banned, but not the Anderson AM-15 .300blk(unless this bill passes). My understanding that those two guns are not heavy barrel firearms from the factory. For example, you can build any HBAR, including a Colt HBAR, even though any AR15 in .223 regular barrel is banned. You just cannot build a HBAR that meets the definition of a "copy cat" weapon, viz., a center fire semi auto gun with a detachable mag, and that has two of three features, a flash suppressor, a grenade launcher or a folding stock, or is less than 29 inches long. See MD Code Criminal Law 4-301(h). That is because the MSP has construed the exemption for the Colt HBAR to include HBARs of any manufacturer. See, e.g., the MSP exemption for Armalite HBARs. ON the other hand, it is perfectly possible to read the bill has imposing a complete ban on all builds from the Anderson receiver. Yet, that result is hard to square with MSP guidance. Under that guidance, it is perfectly legal to purchase the Anderson receiver itself using the 77R process, as the 5-101(r)(2) list includes only long guns, not receivers. The receiver can be legally built into a heavy barrel, a pistol for personal use (you cannot sell the Anderson .223 pistol, or build for distribution as it is not on the Roster, but you can build it for personal use) or a SBR (as long as you comply with the NFA of 1934 and the ATF requirements under that act for SBRs). Again, the 5-101(r)(2) list includes only long guns (classified as "assault long guns under MD Code Criminal Law 4-301), not receivers. See MSP ADVISORY LD-FRS-14-003 (2014). Put differently, a receiver is a "firearm" but it is not an "assault long gun." Given that advisory, it would be odd to hold that you can build a Colt receiver into a heavy barrel, but not an Anderson receiver..... YMMV. Now, I don't think you can EVER build an Anderson .223 regular barrel, as that is already banned, including its manufacture. That would include converting an Anderson Heavy Barrel into a regular barrel. This is not Legal Advice.
     
    Last edited:

    Users who are viewing this thread

    Latest posts

    Forum statistics

    Threads
    274,915
    Messages
    7,258,473
    Members
    33,348
    Latest member
    Eric_Hehl

    Latest threads

    Top Bottom