iH8DemLibz
When All Else Fails.
I'll take a stab at $765.00 for rattletraps.
CMP 1911s update
- Thread starter Armadillofz1
- Start date
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A few things:
—CMP has been saying for a couple of years that they could never ship to C&R holders because the Army had cold feet about the whole deal. A lot of CYA on the Army side, and I guess I can’t blame them since they don’t stand to benefit from this. Still sucks though.
—There are a lot of very nice pistols in govt. hands. It would seem unbelievable (to anyone who hasn’t dealt with the military bureaucracy), but there were still significant numbers of pristine 1911A1s in storage even 70 years after the last one was built. I’m talking about NSWC Crane here, but most likely the Army is the same.
—A lot of people complained when Mark Johnson guessed $1000 for a mixmaster. When he said that arsenal rebuilds were going for more than that and the prices have gone up since then. They go up every year. Unlike Orest, Mark is a gun collector (he collects 1911s). He has apparently priced every item the CMP has ever sold since its inception in the 1990s, so the pricing isn’t an Orest/Mark thing.
—Communication from the CMP the last few years has been TERRIBLE!!! If you guys irritated about CMP Sales communications had seen what was going on on the competition side your heads would explode. CMP is a $250 million organization and needs to act like it.
—CMP has been saying for a couple of years that they could never ship to C&R holders because the Army had cold feet about the whole deal. A lot of CYA on the Army side, and I guess I can’t blame them since they don’t stand to benefit from this. Still sucks though.
—There are a lot of very nice pistols in govt. hands. It would seem unbelievable (to anyone who hasn’t dealt with the military bureaucracy), but there were still significant numbers of pristine 1911A1s in storage even 70 years after the last one was built. I’m talking about NSWC Crane here, but most likely the Army is the same.
—A lot of people complained when Mark Johnson guessed $1000 for a mixmaster. When he said that arsenal rebuilds were going for more than that and the prices have gone up since then. They go up every year. Unlike Orest, Mark is a gun collector (he collects 1911s). He has apparently priced every item the CMP has ever sold since its inception in the 1990s, so the pricing isn’t an Orest/Mark thing.
—Communication from the CMP the last few years has been TERRIBLE!!! If you guys irritated about CMP Sales communications had seen what was going on on the competition side your heads would explode. CMP is a $250 million organization and needs to act like it.
dad4
Ultimate Member
Colt 1911 Army models are going for $2k - $3k on gunbroker (Buy It Now) and that appears to be Mark Johnson's retail reference.
I would be surprised if field grade mixmasters are under $1200. Yes, it might be cheaper to find a new one in a gun shop, but they won't have the gov't markings.
j_h_smith
Ultimate Member
- Jul 28, 2007
- 28,516
Yeah, I was thinking the rust buckets will sell for $1000 with the best examples going for as much as $3000. Earlier serial number models could go for as much as $5000.
This is all speculation on my part, but these will be one of a kind firearms with a history like no other.
I may be over stating the values, but the interest is going to be crazy. I think the CMP will price these so it tries to take away the flipper who will want to make a quick buck in the secondary market.
As the Sharks say in Shark Tank... I'm Out.
Matlack
Scribe
- Dec 15, 2008
- 8,557
I think the 1 a year is meant to stop the flippers.
It will greatly reduce flipping, but even at the high price I think the market is going to be there with big profit to anyone willing to resell.
The next thing will be counterfeited CMP papers for regular junk 1911's
The next thing will be counterfeited CMP papers for regular junk 1911's
Mike OTDP
Ultimate Member
- Feb 12, 2008
- 3,324
If you don't want to jump through CMP's hoops, allow me to observe that $750 will put you into a decent Argentine Sistema Colt.
I'm kind of looking forward to seeing what will be offered. If I feel that its a good deal then I'm gonna jump in there and hopefully grab a decent pistol. If not, meh didn't loose anything.
Abulg1972
Ultimate Member
Just to be clear, the Army has no input on what, how or to whom the CMP ships firearms. The legislation requires the Army to transfer surplus 1911s to the CMP.
I'd bet that if you wait that long, you won't have a chance. If you are even remotely considering one, you better sign up with an affilated club and be ready to jump in line when the notice comes out.
38super
Active Member
The reason these must be shipped to a FFL is due to each state having different laws and to keep them from being sued if someone gets a gun that should not have one and shoot's someone with it. I do not mind having it shipped to a FFL if I have a change of being in the running. I think that they will range from 650.00-950.00 for the lower grade's. I have several original GI 45's that I have bought over the years and would not mind having a rebuilt one from the CMP. 750.00 for a beater 1911 is worth that to me all day long.
iH8DemLibz
When All Else Fails.
The states, most of them, have absolutely no say in whether the CMP can or cannot ship a 1911 directly to a C&R holder's front door.
This is purely a chickensh!t decision made by the folks at CMP. They don't feel like doing the legwork to see which states allow C&R and which states don't. Laziness!
They would have the law, 100%, on their side if they shipped these guns using federal Curio and Relic regulations.
They've chosen not to. Instead, they've chosen to blame their poor decision making skills on the US Army.
Orlando
Active Member
Per the Director of CMP:
1911 type pistols purchased from CMP cannot be transferred to 03 FFL (curio and relic) license. BATF and the United States Army prefer the second background check be performed by a “store front” FFL dealer.
1911 type pistols purchased from CMP cannot be transferred to 03 FFL (curio and relic) license. BATF and the United States Army prefer the second background check be performed by a “store front” FFL dealer.
don't get me wrong, I have already purchased a Garand through them. They already have all my paperwork. Like I said it would be nice to buy one if the opportunity arose.
TheOriginalMexicanBob
Ultimate Member
Can anyone imagine the uproar if it came out that the federal government was shipping handguns directly to civilians? At least going through a licensed gun dealer makes it all ok...apparently.
todbiker
Ultimate Member
Yeah this is disappointing on many levels. Let my first expire, got another one just because occasionally it comes in handy for a purchase and finally a C&R worthy purchase if there ever was one and DENIED!!!! 
so many emotions.....
so many emotions.....
airbornetrooper
Active Member
It's been beat to death already, but that's total horse poop that they are not C&R eligible. Just because some states (looking at you California) are overzealous with their gun laws...
If you’ve got a C&R and you want an M1911, why not just buy one now? There are plenty of them out there and it sounds like CMP won’t be much cheaper.
While the frames are WWII or earlier, the military contracted out parts until the 1980s. There is no telling what parts CMP will use to make these pistols functional. Some of us still use NOS parts to build new pistols.
If you do your homework you can buy an all correct R-R or Ithaca for around $2000. If you just want a mixmaster those can be had for $1000-1200.
Researching the history of these guns, learning about how they were made, and having one shipped to your door now is a lot more fun than complaining about the CMP (though I’ve done my fair share of complaining).
While the frames are WWII or earlier, the military contracted out parts until the 1980s. There is no telling what parts CMP will use to make these pistols functional. Some of us still use NOS parts to build new pistols.
If you do your homework you can buy an all correct R-R or Ithaca for around $2000. If you just want a mixmaster those can be had for $1000-1200.
Researching the history of these guns, learning about how they were made, and having one shipped to your door now is a lot more fun than complaining about the CMP (though I’ve done my fair share of complaining).
Great advice. Unfortunately for me, my love for milsurp and historically significant firearms came too late to really take advantage of the sales aspect of the CMP's mission. Part of what I love about old firearms is going into a shop and finding one that "speaks" to me (metaphorically of course!). I have plenty of guns I have bought online, but I would really like to pick out an M1 garand and/or WWI/II 1911 in person. It's silly, but I want American milsurps that have a good bit of character and ideally an interesting history, even if they aren't in perfect shape. Shootable condition would be nice. It's unfortunate I don't have the options a lot of you older and wiser folk did.
Not blaming CMP for the 1911 situation, but it just doesn't seem like much fun to me. I'll let other people fight over the first few batches and see where things are in a few years.
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