NRA Sells us out again?

Bob A · Jun 29, 2020

Occam said:
No, what we got was a reversible executive branch action on one narrow thing when, in the wake of two hugely high profile mass shootings, we were otherwise about to get much MUCH worse actual legislation. Legislation that would have included stuff beyond just the bump stocks. After Vegas, it was going to happen. It got dumbed down and narrowed down to the least bad thing it could have been compared to what there was strong House and enough Senate support to do as actual law.

What happened behind the scenes, to limit the unavoidable damage, was very well documented. Not sure why people forget the relevant details.

The continuous barrage of media Trump-hatred, along with the distortions, half-truths and outright lies, tends to bury rational thought as peoples' minds are swamped with ever more ridiculous vituperation.

Meanwhile, the No Shades Of Grey people can see things only in black and white; anything that isn't absolutely for them is absolutely against them.

Both sides are guilty of this closed-minded thinking. It's a natural result of being buried in BSm 24/7/365.

outrider58 · Jun 29, 2020

Bob A said:
The continuous barrage of media Trump-hatred, along with the distortions, half-truths and outright lies, tends to bury rational thought as peoples' minds are swamped with ever more ridiculous vituperation.

Meanwhile, the No Shades Of Grey people can see things only in black and white; anything that isn't absolutely for them is absolutely against them.

Both sides are guilty of this closed-minded thinking. It's a natural result of being buried in BSm 24/7/365.

Nice post Bob A. So much truth.
I learned a new word today.

Alea Jacta Est · Jun 29, 2020

outrider58 said:
Nice post Bob A. So much truth.
I learned a new word today.

Ridiculous vituperation.

Exceeded the MDS syllabic pentameter. May be a new record.

Almost ten in two. Wow. I’m humbled.

DanGuy48 · Jun 29, 2020

We’ve been fighting a losing battle IMO. I see no need to accelerate the pace by playing into democrats hands and infighting with one of the lobbies they fear the most. As long as the NRA irritates and obstructs Democrats, I will support them.

And let’s not throw out the baby with the bath water. The NRA trains instructors and RSOs, coaches, etc., to a national standard, they help in range developmemt, sponsoring and running matches, all manner of things that we should all support. If the efforts of the NRA- ILA or NRA-PVF run counter to your interests, don’t support them. Personally, I wouldn’t give another nickel to GOA. In my opinion all they do is bitch and moan and hurl dirt at the NRA and others that don’t bitch and moan as loudly as they do. The biggest bang for the buck, again IMO, is the SAF and grassroots organizations like MSI.

fred2207 · Jun 29, 2020

Occam said:
I'm ashamed that half the country and almost the entire media/academia complex is aggressively pursuing a meat puppet candidate and puppeteers so wildly, insanely worse (than Trump) that we have to even contemplate how awful them winning would be. We dodged a bullet with that in 2016, and need to do it again. I would love a philosopher king type genius orator with liberty on his mind as our candidate, but that person doesn't exist (or at least, isn't willing to have his or her life and family ruined by the media). So we do what we must, and decide we really don't take Trump's manners personally. The people on the left shrieking out their TDS are the ones who take it personally, like children always do.

No chief executive is or should be my moral guide, or my personal inspiration, or the person who tells me how or what to do. It's an important gig running one branch of the government, not my daddy. As it happens, considering who and what wants to take over that job, we're fortunate to have a guy who really doesn't care what most people think about him personally. And who is just trying to get shit done despite historically unprecedented - even criminal - push back and sabotage. I don't have to feel personal shame at tolerating his shortcomings, because I didn't make a bad call voting to prevent the Clinton machine from retaking the White House.

Yea, I keep forgetting. "moral character is not a requirement for political leadership". :sad20:

s%#t...

Occam · Jun 29, 2020

fred2207 said:
Yea, I keep forgetting. "moral character is not a requirement for political leadership". s%#t...

You’re pretending to confuse a moral stance (on, say, continuing endless wars or fighting Chinese economic espionage or naming constitutionalist justices or tackling prison reform etc) with annoying mannerisms. Not fooling anyone.

John from MD · Jun 29, 2020

fred2207 said:
Yea, I keep forgetting. "moral character is not a requirement for political leadership". s%#t...

I don't know if the rules have changed but, back in the day, the Federal Aviation Regulations stated that to hold an Airline Transport Rating, you had to be of good moral character.

Imagine that, people responsible for other people's lives had to be of good moral character but congress critters, who have a great effect over people's lives don't. :sad20:

OLM-Medic · Jun 29, 2020

I just donated $100 to SAF and GOA last month. I'll never give NRA a cent until they acknowledge their corruption and restructure.

GuitarmanNick · Jun 30, 2020

I have not been a member for a very long time and only joined last year because I was planning to shoot @ AGC. Never could put the fee together for the range badge due to budget constraints so it ended up being a waste of money, IMO.

The NRA has been selling out it's members for at least the last 50 years while it's leadership has done very well for itself! It was a great concept that has failed because of corruption which finds it's way into anything involving money and power!

Evil is everywhere in this world. Trust is a very rare commodity!

Alea Jacta Est · Jun 30, 2020

Ollie North was spot on.

Bob A · Jun 30, 2020

GuitarmanNick said:
I have not been a member for a very long time and only joined last year because I was planning to shoot @ AGC. Never could put the fee together for the range badge due to budget constraints so it ended up being a waste of money, IMO.

The NRA has been selling out it's members for at least the last 50 years while it's leadership has done very well for itself! It was a great concept that has failed because of corruption which finds it's way into anything involving money and power!

Evil is everywhere in this world. Trust is a very rare commodity!

Like the government whose over-regulation it undertook to oppose, the NRA is suffering from bloat.

The government's attempts to stifle the 2nd Amendment resulted in over-funding the NRA, as the membership coughed up the funds to oppose the encroachment on their rights. The river of cash enabled the NRA to grow into the donation-Hoover organisation it is today.

That re-defined the mission, formerly education and support for firearms enthusiasts, from education and advocacy for the 2A, into an oranisation focused on increasing cash flow. (The similarity between NRA and major parts of the US govt in this respect is worthy of note).

It's grown too large to accomplish its original mission. Trying to limit the growth of an organism in this state of its development is a difficult proposition, not to say impossible.

Like a physical cancer, the only cure is to starve it of nutrients, and hope that the cancer will die while the organism subject to its parasitism is strong enough to survive the treatment.

.

CrueChief · Jun 30, 2020

Nnztg8r said:
If we all know it then why are they still in business??

Fudds, a lot of "hunting/shooting groups" require membership in the NRA for a membership in their ORG.

Bohemian · Jul 1, 2020

SO Is It Legit Or Not

I know MarineGunBuilder is Legit but I've yet to find anything supporting his claim on this issue...

I think that should be the top priority here, before we bash the NRA over something they might have done.

I agree in the past, even recent past they've done us no favors on critical Precedent Setting 2A issues...

but I really want to see some facts on this one that support or refute this claim from verifible sources if possible.

I just found this from a couple months ago showing the NRA Opposed this bill:
https://www.nraila.org/articles/202...-vote-to-ban-home-manufactured-firearms-today

thanks in advance.

Ilexopaca · Jul 1, 2020

If one's goal is to secure their 2-A rights a strategy based on the idea of maintaining a perpetual, uninterrupted stream of conservative presidents and justices seems foolhardy.

What has worked for the majority of our history is the overwhelming consensus among ordinary Americans that we all have the right to bear arms.

Yet many gun owner's thinking is still informed by the NRA's stoking of paranoia in order to line their pockets. A paranoia that also leads people to proactively undermine or skirt laws with devices such as 80% lowers and bump stocks. Which in turn stokes paranoia among non-gun owners who can see this law skirting for what it is.

It is self-defeating. Paranoid, armed, law-breakers are perceived as bad guys in the eyes of most ordinary Americans. They are only "good guys with guns" in the eyes of a minority of Americans. Not only is the NRA totally, irretrievably corrupt but they have completely failed in their stated mission.

Long-term it's the voters that matter, not politicians or judges.

A simple rebranding will not solve this problem. It's time to garner consensus and put support behind a single alternative organization with an effective long-term strategy to ensure that a majority of ordinary Americans continue to value their 2A rights.

The fact of the matter is that collectively, we, the members of this forum, I'm guessing - are pretty much armed to the teeth. Not because of the NRA but in spite of it. It's time to let go of all the NRA's ******** tactics of fear-mongering. Cool heads will prevail - don't get your panties all tied up in knots.

Boxcab · Jul 1, 2020

Ilexopaca said:
If one's goal is to secure their 2-A rights a strategy based on the idea of maintaining a perpetual, uninterrupted stream of conservative presidents and justices seems foolhardy.

What has worked for the majority of our history is the overwhelming consensus among ordinary Americans that we all have the right to bear arms.

Yet many gun owner's thinking is still informed by the NRA's stoking of paranoia in order to line their pockets. A paranoia that also leads people to proactively undermine or skirt laws with devices such as 80% lowers and bump stocks. Which in turn stokes paranoia among non-gun owners who can see this law skirting for what it is.

It is self-defeating. Paranoid, armed, law-breakers are perceived as bad guys in the eyes of most ordinary Americans. They are only "good guys with guns" in the eyes of a minority of Americans. Not only is the NRA totally, irretrievably corrupt but they have completely failed in their stated mission.

Long-term it's the voters that matter, not politicians or judges.

A simple rebranding will not solve this problem. It's time to garner consensus and put support behind a single alternative organization with an effective long-term strategy to ensure that a majority of ordinary Americans continue to value their 2A rights.

The fact of the matter is that collectively, we, the members of this forum, I'm guessing - are pretty much armed to the teeth. Not because of the NRA but in spite of it. It's time to let go of all the NRA's ******** tactics of fear-mongering. Cool heads will prevail - don't get your panties all tied up in knots.

Nice write-up. Welcome aboard.

.

rick3d · Jul 1, 2020

People, beware of memetic warfare... They want us to be divided, this may be fake news! Also, if it was true, I rather have the NRA write it than some ignorant liberal.

sturmgewehr44 · Jul 1, 2020

You’re CORRECT!!!

lemmdus · Jul 1, 2020

Unfortunately I signed up and paid my life membership dues awhile back. I will not send them one dime until they change. They should not be supporting ANY Democrat. That Democrat gets into office, that gives the another vote towards majority. Not to mention their slogan "Stand and Fight!" WTH is that? I don't want to play defense, you do that and you lose. I want to advance, repeal stupid gun laws and make sure they never come back. But, if the SCOTUS rules the 2A means what it says, they lose their money train and Wayne will have to shop at Khols like normal people instead of Rodeo Drive in Beverly Hills.

Doug Hile · Jul 1, 2020

Have No idea if this is true,, but,, with all their posturing about protecting the 2A, the NRA has, none the less, allowed Maryland libtards to eliminate the Second Amendment, under a mountain of INFRINGEMENTS.

Doco Overboard · Jul 1, 2020

Bob A said:
Like the government whose over-regulation it undertook to oppose, the NRA is suffering from bloat.

The government's attempts to stifle the 2nd Amendment resulted in over-funding the NRA, as the membership coughed up the funds to oppose the encroachment on their rights. The river of cash enabled the NRA to grow into the donation-Hoover organisation it is today.

That re-defined the mission, formerly education and support for firearms enthusiasts, from education and advocacy for the 2A, into an oranisation focused on increasing cash flow. (The similarity between NRA and major parts of the US govt in this respect is worthy of note).

It's grown too large to accomplish its original mission. Trying to limit the growth of an organism in this state of its development is a difficult proposition, not to say impossible.

Like a physical cancer, the only cure is to starve it of nutrients, and hope that the cancer will die while the organism subject to its parasitism is strong enough to survive the treatment.

.

Organizations that tend to grow horizontally instead of vertically are all subject to the same sort of "lack" bloat or whatever you may call it instead of the ascension to enhanced problem solving, methods of increased efficiency or productivity seem to be held back by one or more senior leaders who are never questioned by their subordinates because of fear or failure.

The internal culture has become corrupt or overly tribal.

NRA Sells us out again?

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