Buying an AR-15 out of state Mag question

Rob R. · Nov 2, 2016

Searched for this already and many post were dated or unclear.

I am interested in buying a AR15 (HBAR) in either PA or Delaware and the rifle only comes in one version with a 30rd magazine.
I read in one thread that it is a cash and carry rifle and when out of state it's ok to have the 30rd magazine included as this person did so in PA previously

In another thread I read someone stating it must comply with Maryland fully (not just HBAR alone) and that a dealer may out right deny or can sub a 10/20rd magazine or just remove the magazine altogether "err on the side of caution"

So what's the correct answer since there seems to be a different answer for every question.
For those that bought out of state what has been your experience?

TTMD · Nov 2, 2016

It is 100% legal for a Maryland resident to buy >10 round magazines out of state & carry them back into the state. That doesn't change if you're buying a rifle at the same time.

What that non-MD dealer may or may not deny or substitute is a different question.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

platoonDaddy · Nov 2, 2016

[URL=http://s933.photobucket.com/user/slickville/media/troll_zpsn1izgxml.png.html]

[/URL]

newmuzzleloader · Nov 2, 2016

But it is also entirely up to the dealer whether he will sell said magazine with the rifle to a Md. resident. So both of your answers you found are correct.

Rob R. · Nov 2, 2016

Thank you for the replies.. I tried searching for the actual documentation from a state site showing this information to then bring to either dealer but failed to find it, mostly random other sites have it posted

Anyone have a link?

Mike · Nov 2, 2016

Rob R. said:
Searched for this already and many post were dated or unclear.

I am interested in buying a AR15 (HBAR) in either PA or Delaware and the rifle only comes in one version with a 30rd magazine.
I read in one thread that it is a cash and carry rifle and when out of state it's ok to have the 30rd magazine included as this person did so in PA previously

In another thread I read someone stating it must comply with Maryland fully (not just HBAR alone) and that a dealer may out right deny or can sub a 10/20rd magazine or just remove the magazine altogether "err on the side of caution"

So what's the correct answer since there seems to be a different answer for every question.
For those that bought out of state what has been your experience?

As a MD resident, any AR-15 you purchase must be marked or advertised as HBAR or heavy barrel. In addition it must not be listed as banned by the state police. Click this link for the list. http://mdsp.maryland.gov/Organizati...LicensingDivision/Firearms/FirearmSearch.aspx

Also the overall length must comply with MD law.

Maryland Law, Criminal Law Article ("CR"). § 4-201 (f), defines "short-barreled rifle" as a rifle that has:

1. One or more barrels with one or both measuring less than 16 inches long; OR
2. Has an overall length of less than 26 inches AND was manufactured from a rifle either by alteration or modification. [snip; there is more on the MSP site]

If you are able to find and purchase a compliant rifle while out of state, it may have any capacity magazine you desire. Because of the total lack of clarity in the MD laws, some FFLs in other states might simply refuse to sell you any firearm. You may be better off going to an industry partner listed here to purchase the rifle, then go out of state to buy the magazines. https://www.mdshooters.com/forumdisplay.php?f=106

(I was working on this post while the prior posts were provided.)

esqappellate · Nov 2, 2016

Mike said:
As a MD resident, any AR-15 you purchase must be marked or advertised as HBAR or heavy barrel. In addition it must not be listed as banned by the state police. Click this link for the list. http://mdsp.maryland.gov/Organizati...LicensingDivision/Firearms/FirearmSearch.aspx

Also the overall length must comply with MD law.

Maryland Law, Criminal Law Article ("CR"). § 4-201 (f), defines "short-barreled rifle" as a rifle that has:

1. One or more barrels with one or both measuring less than 16 inches long; OR
2. Has an overall length of less than 26 inches AND was manufactured from a rifle either by alteration or modification. [snip; there is more on the MSP site]

If you are able to find and purchase a compliant rifle while out of state, it may have any capacity magazine you desire. Because of the total lack of clarity in the MD laws, some FFLs in other states might simply refuse to sell you any firearm. You may be better off going to an industry partner listed here to purchase the rifle, then go out of state to buy the magazines. https://www.mdshooters.com/forumdisplay.php?f=106

(I was working on this post while the prior posts were provided.)

Good summary and good link. Here's a thought. Maryland would like nothing better than to put out of business as many dealers as possible. The HQL requirements were onerous in part for just that reason. So think about buying the legal gun in state (assuming that the price is competitive ), and then just buying the magazine(s) on your next trip out of state. Most dealers will swap out the 30 round mag for a 10 round mag at the time of sale in Maryland. It just means you have an extra 10 round mag lying around. Use it for shooting off a bench.

Rob R. · Nov 2, 2016

The price difference is significant and buying in DE tax free would be another factor. I guess the easy way out is just spending the money on shipping and the transfer fee plus losing the mag to a dealer who locally already said it's ok to ship with 30rd but can't hand it over to me with such under MD law and I already knew that would be the case

eruby · Nov 2, 2016

Welcome aboard Rob R.!!

Go here and post up:

https://www.mdshooters.com/forumdisplay.php?f=119 :thumbsup:

My advice is to go to a gun store and buy an HBAR with a 30 round standard capacity magazine. If the owner won't sell, go to a different store.

I may or may not have purchased an HBAR w/ 30 rd mag in Western PA in less than 15 minutes (I did see you are looking in Delaware).

Alanbdot · Nov 2, 2016

My interpretation would be that its totally fine for the 30rd to come from PA to MD. Im no lawyer but that is how I would understand it to work.

gmharle · Nov 2, 2016

The three places that I am familiar with just across the PA line, High Rock Outfitters is an IP(Hanover), The Gun Bunker (Shrewsbury) and Freedom Armory (Glen Rock) are very familiar with MD law and sympathetic to the challenges for MD residents. All three will sell you an AR HBAR rifle with 30 round magazines.

HRDWRK · Nov 2, 2016

Rob R. said:
Searched for this already and many post were dated or unclear.

I am interested in buying a AR15 (HBAR) in either PA or Delaware and the rifle only comes in one version with a 30rd magazine.
I read in one thread that it is a cash and carry rifle and when out of state it's ok to have the 30rd magazine included as this person did so in PA previously

In another thread I read someone stating it must comply with Maryland fully (not just HBAR alone) and that a dealer may out right deny or can sub a 10/20rd magazine or just remove the magazine altogether "err on the side of caution"

So what's the correct answer since there seems to be a different answer for every question.
For those that bought out of state what has been your experience?

Rob R,
First post!
How much will you really save buying that ar from Delaware.
You will save 6% , your gas and time are worth alot more than that I would hope.
What would you gain from buying said ar from a Md dealer?
Peace of mind in knowing that a MD dealer will sell you a MD legal firearm.
Peace of mind that you will support a MD dealer.
If you have questions will you call or drive back to Delaware or will you ask questions of your local MD dealer or on this MD forum,

platoonDaddy said:
[URL=http://s933.photobucket.com/user/slickville/media/troll_zpsn1izgxml.png.html] [/URL]

If this apply to you I hope the answers you hoped to find will not help you in anyway.

Introduce yourself as suggested in another post.

GolfR · Nov 2, 2016

My understanding was that you can't buy a gun out of state and bring it home, is this incorrect? I thought that you had to have the out of state vendor send it to an MD FFL for the transfer. If this is the case, you have to tack on the $50 or so that a local FFL charges for the transfer and background check.

I agree with the earlier poster, if they won't sell you the 10+ rd mag in another state, go to another store. It's completely legal to do so and bring it back into MD with you. The other side of the coin is that you can't blame anyone for being confused by our stupid state laws!

Mike · Nov 2, 2016

GolfR said:
My understanding was that you can't buy a hand gun out of state ~~and bring it home, is this incorrect~~? ~~I thought that you had to~~ have the out of state vendor send ithand guns to an MD FFL for the transfer. If this is the case, you have to tack on the $50 or so that a local FFL charges for the transfer and background check.

I agree with the earlier poster, if they won't sell you the 10+ rd mag in another state, go to another store. It's completely legal to do so and bring it back into MD with you. The other side of the coin is that you can't blame anyone for being confused by our stupid state laws!

Now I believe it's correct. Cash & carry long guns (i.e., rifles) may be purchased in other states.

Rob R. · Nov 2, 2016

HRDWRK said:
Rob R,
First post!
How much will you really save buying that ar from Delaware.
You will save 6% , your gas and time are worth alot more than that I would hope.
What would you gain from buying said ar from a Md dealer?
Peace of mind in knowing that a MD dealer will sell you a MD legal firearm.
Peace of mind that you will support a MD dealer.
If you have questions will you call or drive back to Delaware or will you ask questions of your local MD dealer or on this MD forum,

If this apply to you I hope the answers you hoped to find will not help you in anyway.

Introduce yourself as suggested in another post.

How much will I save on a $2k AR well $120 in tax, $50 FFL fee, loss of a mag, and the gun is priced $700 cheaper out of state and it gives me a reason to visit friends or family in either state, not sure why I had explain in further detail but whatever there ya have it..
As much as I love to support local business as I am one and have done so more than most I'd prefer to invest that $1,000 elsewhere like a handgun and ammunition I can buy from a local gun shop. Already confirmed with my local dealer this AR fits the required Maryland guidelines and gave me the green light to ship to him but suggested I just drive to PA and cash and carry and have it in my hands asap save the ship fee and transfer fee.

As for that picture posted I have no idea what exactly that is insinuating

Rob R. · Nov 2, 2016

Alanbdot said:
My interpretation would be that its totally fine for the 30rd to come from PA to MD. Im no lawyer but that is how I would understand it to work.

Exactly how I read it, but same as you I am no lawyer either.. as we all know laws of the land are usually written in such a way as to promote some type of confusion or just general lack of clarity.. unless of course you hire another lawyer to fully interpret it. It's a great way to keep that occupation healthy and thriving

eruby · Nov 2, 2016

Rob, see my post "9. Perfectly legal. Don't overthink this.

GolfR · Nov 2, 2016

Mike said:
Now I believe it's correct. Cash & carry long guns (i.e., rifles) may be purchased in other states.

Thanks for the clarification and sorry for the confusion if I caused any!

Rob R. · Nov 2, 2016

eruby said:
Rob, see my post "9. Perfectly legal. Don't overthink this.

Exactly what I was looking for!! Thank you!
First hand experience and perfectly legal just wish all surrounding dealers to Maryland understood this fully not just the ones on the MD/PA line. If I were a gun dealer I would want to be informed and knowledgeable about what I can and cannot do with buyers connected to my home states borders but maybe that's just me

Buying an AR-15 out of state Mag question

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