Marksmanship versus caliber

The #1 community for Gun Owners of the Northeast

Member Benefits:

  • No ad networks!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • knastera

    Just another shooter
    May 6, 2013
    1,484
    Baltimore County
    So many times, we see discussions, debates, and diatribes about which caliber is best. This article from the USCCA addresses what I think is the true measure of stopping power, marksmanship.
     
    Last edited by a moderator:

    knastera

    Just another shooter
    May 6, 2013
    1,484
    Baltimore County
    I saw a perfect example of this on Saturday. I had a student at the range shooting for the very first time ever. She is a small woman and has the beginnings of arthritis in her hands. After her third shot with a Ruger SR-22, she proceeded to put 16 rounds of 22lr in the 9, 10, and X rings at 25 feet. .380 ACP, 38 Special, and 9mm all had too much recoil for her. When we were done shooting, I showed her 22lr hollow point for defensive purposes and encouraged her to keep practicing with 22lr. She understands that she may need to take several shots, but as a brand new shooter, she is already confident.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,410
    Glen Burnie
    I saw a perfect example of this on Saturday. I had a student at the range shooting for the very first time ever. She is a small woman and has the beginnings of arthritis in her hands. After her third shot with a Ruger SR-22, she proceeded to put 16 rounds of 22lr in the 9, 10, and X rings at 25 feet. .380 ACP, 38 Special, and 9mm all had too much recoil for her. When we were done shooting, I showed her 22lr hollow point for defensive purposes and encouraged her to keep practicing with 22lr. She understands that she may need to take several shots, but as a brand new shooter, she is already confident.

    where were the other caliber shots at a more realistic self defense distance of contact to 7-10 yards?
     
    Feb 22, 2012
    61
    Baltimore County
    My wife had been accompanying me to the range for years and when she was ready to purchase her first gun she chose a Ruger Mark. She has demonstrated the ability to safely and effectively use other calibers including 32ACP, 9mm, 40 S&W, but she is much more accurate and comfortable with her .22LR Ruger. She understands that in a defensive situation the smaller round will not perform like a service round but the comfort and familiarity factor can't be dismissed, either. I would much rather her put two or three 36gr CCI mini-mags into an intruder's torso than one 9mm into his arm and one through my front door and into my neighbor's house.

    Sometimes us 'gun nuts' tend to forget that there are lots of Constitution-loving Americans who don't even like guns but own firearms to exercise their constitutionally protected rights and/or for personal protection. Some of these folks don't enjoy shooting and may be truly recoil and noise sensitive. Personally, I am happy that they have chosen to be armed even though they don't enjoy shooting. If they lack the desire or arm/hand strength or ability to handle noise to be able to train with larger calibers, but do take the time to train with something that they can tolerate (like a smaller 22LR or 25ACP), then kudos to them and God Bless them for it.
     

    knastera

    Just another shooter
    May 6, 2013
    1,484
    Baltimore County
    where were the other caliber shots at a more realistic self defense distance of contact to 7-10 yards?



    All shots where taken at 25 feet (8.33 yards). She was on the paper with those, but her apprehension over the recoil of everything above 22 was enough for me to recommend she stay with the 22. The other reason I took that approach is because I first want her to develop basic marksmanship skills. If she is apprehensive over larger calibers, she won't go to the range, and if she doesn't go to the range, her skills will not develop. Going to the range helps to develop many things including resistance to the noise of gunfire. Maybe in a year, she'll be able to consider something more powerful, but for now, she is fine.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,410
    Glen Burnie
    LOL my bad. You must be a small bore competition shooter. You said feet and I saw yards. :)

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
     

    Outerlimits

    Active Member
    Feb 21, 2009
    502
    Port Tobacco/Cape Coral Fl
    It really doesn't matter what caliber you shoot, if you don't hit the intended target, you better hope the noise scares them to death. I have read on other forums all the arguments for stopping power vs accuracy. I you cant hit your target you will stop nothing!! Even USCCA has stated that usually it take more than one shot to stop and individual and end the threat. So we are back to accuracy again, even if you manage to put a shot on target, the threat will not usually stop with one shot, unless its a head shot. The follow up shots must hit the mark also in order to stop the threat.
    Shoot what you are confident with, I pray that you never need to use deadly force.
     

    3rdRcn

    RIP
    Industry Partner
    Sep 9, 2007
    8,961
    Harford County
    We mention 22LR for women, one might also consider 22 magnum for a lady or even a man. Hornady makes critical defense in this caliber and Smith makes a very nice revolver chambered for it with very little recoil from a nasty little round.
     

    knastera

    Just another shooter
    May 6, 2013
    1,484
    Baltimore County
    It really doesn't matter what caliber you shoot, if you don't hit the intended target, you better hope the noise scares them to death. I have read on other forums all the arguments for stopping power vs accuracy. I you cant hit your target you will stop nothing!! Even USCCA has stated that usually it take more than one shot to stop and individual and end the threat. So we are back to accuracy again, even if you manage to put a shot on target, the threat will not usually stop with one shot, unless its a head shot. The follow up shots must hit the mark also in order to stop the threat.
    Shoot what you are confident with, I pray that you never need to use deadly force.



    The one thing I tell people that use 22LR for defense is to drop their POA about 6" from the center of the sternum to just below the diaphragm. Belly shots will cause a lot of internal trauma and bleeding.
     

    rob-cubed

    In need of moderation
    Sep 24, 2009
    5,387
    Holding the line in Baltimore
    The X factor is always how badly the bad guy wants to fight back. Folks have shaken off multiple hits short of a direct CNS, whether it's due to drugs or mental illness or adrenaline and desperation. Others will run at the mere suggestion of being shot. This is one of the reasons the caliber debate is fairly irrelevant. It doesn't take a host of other variables into account.

    The FBI moving to 10mm as a result of this particular shooting, and then backing away from it again, are proof that caliber isn't the only factor at play.

    Shoot what you are comfortable with and be willing to pull the trigger when it's necessary. Personally I don't consider .22 a self defense round, but it's still lethal and can safe a life.
     

    Blaster229

    God loves you, I don't.
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 14, 2010
    46,410
    Glen Burnie
    We mention 22LR for women, one might also consider 22 magnum for a lady or even a man. Hornady makes critical defense in this caliber and Smith makes a very nice revolver chambered for it with very little recoil from a nasty little round.

    I'd rock a 22 mag.
     

    knastera

    Just another shooter
    May 6, 2013
    1,484
    Baltimore County
    Like this one?
    26a92b8f30e99c7c2c66b7f31dbfde05.jpeg
    It's a Kel-Tec PMR-30. 30 rounds of 22 Magnum is pretty awesome.
     

    AlanInSilverSpring

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Apr 25, 2017
    1,645
    The gun is Maryland legal but there is a note in the roster: "Subject to magazine capacity req. under MD.Law." I guess you can buy one if your FFL sells it without the magazines or if the magazines are pinned to ten rounds.

    Okay. Silly me, I thought maybe there was an exception. Same bs. That stupid law doesn't do anything but make everything a royal pia and syphon extra money out of your pocket.
     

    Users who are viewing this thread

    Latest posts

    Forum statistics

    Threads
    274,940
    Messages
    7,259,671
    Members
    33,350
    Latest member
    Rotorboater

    Latest threads

    Top Bottom