PTP gets pulled over

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  • Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    The video provides insights when a handgun carrier get pulled over.

     

    slsc98

    Ultimate Member
    May 24, 2012
    6,746
    Escaped MD-stan to WNC Smokies
    Bloomberg, et al’s heads are exploding, watching decades of incredibly effective brain-washing at various state’s police training commissions and basic training academies - across the country BUT PARTICULARLY MD, NY, NJ, MA, etc.) going out the window!
     
    Last edited:

    babalou

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Aug 12, 2013
    16,019
    Glenelg
    the hgp license should be suffice. Like it said they are not to do so but the msp head stated as such. ahole
     

    Abuck

    Ultimate Member
    Individual LEO need to be educated that they themselves can be found liable in civil rights violations.

    As I’ve stated many times, we often hear that ignorance is no excuse for the law. That works both ways.

    SCOTUS has taken a dim view with “running serial numbers just because they can” in Arizona v. Hicks.
     

    Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    Individual LEO need to be educated that they themselves can be found liable in civil rights violations.

    As I’ve stated many times, we often hear that ignorance is no excuse for the law. That works both ways.

    SCOTUS has taken a dim view with “running serial numbers just because they can” in Arizona v. Hicks.
    This is what I noticed.

    Why does the MSP need to run the serial number, when no crime exists after verifying the carry permit is valid?
     

    Abuck

    Ultimate Member
    Just because one has a permit doesn't mean a firearm in their possession isn't stolen.
    So guilty until proven innocent?
    2D6F0BEE-CCD5-4922-A663-21817E840389.jpeg
     

    Zaicran

    Active Member
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 26, 2010
    910
    Morganza, MD
    So guilty until proven innocent?

    That’s not how this works, that’s not how any of this works!
    Nobody said anything about being guilty. LEO can disarm you during the stop, which means they can run the serial while said firearm is in their possession.
     

    Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    The other observation the trooper made about running the serial number, was that they were just following orders because that is what their leadership's directed.
     

    Abuck

    Ultimate Member
    Nobody said anything about being guilty. LEO can disarm you during the stop, which means they can run the serial while said firearm is in their possession.
    You didn’t read anything of the SCOTUS case I cited, did you?

    There are steps before a seizure can take place. Or we will see you in court. They can disarm for officer safety, aka a Terry frisk. But they don’t automatically have the right to run the serial #. That goes against our constitutional rights.
     

    jrumann59

    DILLIGAF
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 17, 2011
    14,024
    Stepping out of the car seems awful nice of him.
    Honestly it sets everyone at ease. Can you imagine the possible CF it would cause trying to extract your gun from a sitting position without it looking threatening. The way PTP guy handled it was nice he was able to remove holster and gun without drawing the gun. Those of use with 3-4 or 6 o'clock carry would definitely need to step out of the vehicle so movements do not get mistaken as furtive.
     

    Abuck

    Ultimate Member
    To make it easier/harder however you look at it, keep your serial numbers out of reach of the plain view doctrine. To me, he gave it to them in the holster. They had to commit an action to view the serial number, ie took it out of the holster, so that means it was not within plain view.

    In the Arizona v. Hicks case, the stereo was moved to get the #, here it’s the firearm being manipulated and having the number run for no legal reason.

     

    Boats

    Beer, Bikes n Boomsticks
    Mar 13, 2012
    4,073
    Howeird County
    Bloomberg, et al’s heads are exploding, watching decades of incredibly effective brain-washing at various state’s police training commissions and basic training academies - across the country BUT PARTICULARLY MD, NY, NJ, MA, etc.) going out the window!

    In what way has it gone out the window?

    He had gun stickers on his car, let's ask him if he has a gun. Eh, ok, fair enough, officer safety, even though we initiated a traffic stop for speeding

    He says he has a gun, but his hands are visible and he is obeying commands.

    "Sir, don't reach for yours and we won't reach for ours. Here is your warning/citation. Have a nice day" Is how that should have gone.

    Ok, we wanna see your carry permit. We wanna run the serial number. And any argument increases the chance of this going very bad very quickly a la Philandro Castile.

    Until it becomes common perception that citizens have AS MUCH RIGHT to be armed as police, then Bloomberg etc. are still winning.

    Nothing against the troopers. They didn't do anything wrong or illegal. This is a common perception issue. IMHO
     

    Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    Nothing against the troopers. They didn't do anything wrong or illegal. This is a common perception issue. IMHO
    IMHO they crossed the line by running the serial number when no crime was committed.

    Which brings up an interesting scenario: What liabilities are incurred when the trooper is manipulating the firearm and it discharges?
     

    Brikhaus

    Active Member
    Jun 7, 2013
    252
    Western Marylandistan
    Individual LEO need to be educated that they themselves can be found liable in civil rights violations.

    As I’ve stated many times, we often hear that ignorance is no excuse for the law. That works both ways.

    SCOTUS has taken a dim view with “running serial numbers just because they can” in Arizona v. Hicks.
    Beat me to it. The senior trooper tries to play it off as an unofficial policy, but barring additional criminal indicators it is a 4A violation,

    For those that say they don't want to, or will not get out of the car, save yourself a headache. The police can order you out of the car for any, or absolutely no reason. (MD. v. Wilson & PA v. Mimms). And if they become aware of your weapon, they can disarm you for the duration of the stop. That's why it's best, IMHO, to not volunteer that information, unless required by law. Obviously, the graphics on the car clued them in to ask about them.
     

    jrumann59

    DILLIGAF
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 17, 2011
    14,024
    IMHO they crossed the line by running the serial number when no crime was committed.

    Which brings up an interesting scenario: What liabilities are incurred when the trooper is manipulating the firearm and it discharges?
    It would depend, but I would almost say most of the liability would be carried by the troopers. If I hand you a gun and you are not familiar with its fully safe operation and shoot yourself, now if you had a "hair trigger" in it and didn't disclose it some would transfer to you.
     

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