NYC CCW case is at SCOTUS!

[243hunter]

The 16 hr training requirement may deter some but it wont deter most.

Illinois has a 16 hr requirement and it hasnt deterred very many people at all. Even for out of state applicants.

Illinois even charges $150 application fee for residents and $300 for non-residents.

They have received and are still receiving enough applications that it takes 4-5 months to get approved without fingerprints and 3-4 months if you do submit fingerprints.

Maryland, because they have zero reciprocity will get a ton of out of state applicants. Mostly for those who live out of state and travel to see relatives who live in maryland. As well as those who travel to Maryland for business purposes but do not own a business inside Maryland to get the exemption.

If 16 hours of training is a deterrant to getting a permit, maybe you shouldn't really carry.

Even though i live in Texas a constitutional carry state. I STILL teach NRA firearms classes to many who wish to carry under CC. Responsible adults who want to be safe. All of my classes are always full.

While I do support every state having CC. I still support everyone needing training.

IL is taking that long because they are slow walking the applications, and finding excuse after excuse not to issue the permits. Not enough staff, not enough funds, even though they gave away their funding, the printer broke down, or the best one we don't have enough funds to purchase printer ink.

 

[E.Shell]

Mandatory training should be nonexistent

Strongly agree.

That works for us in PA.

I too agree.

While I believe training is an excellent idea and really should be undertaken for safety and efficacy, I believe more strongly that there should be NO mandatory conditions required to exercise a human right.

Not only is the travel, time and money investment in training an excessive burden and impediment to many people, but the associated record-keeping is yet another way to identify and list (register) anyone with firearms. Doesn't make sense to object to HQLs and FOIDs on principle, but then demand training for personal protection.

 

[Texasgrillchef]

Hopefully this is one way ahead in the future to reduce the burden. It’s the very definition of class warfare, and a form of discrimination.


Mandatory training should be limited to one 8 hour session, maximum. Someone shouldn’t also need a hotel room on top of that cost. I could foresee more games from a few select states, such as 40 hours mandatory, every year, with the training sessions costs going up accordingly. Then they can claim those aren’t state fees.

If Hawaii gets their way with one bill. Someone who wants to get a permit to carry will have to get 16 hours of training every 6 months as the permit is only valid for 6 months. Instructors are NOT excluded so they have to take the class that they teach as well every 6 months! crazy! Although the bill will finally grant as shall issue.

Hopefully that bill wont pass!

What some instructors maydo is have dual instructors teach the class and they sign off on each other.

Then you still have a CC state like Texas that training cant NOT be taught out of state. Even though we are CC there are still places you cant carry in the state without a permit.

 

[Abuck]

The 16 hr training requirement may deter some but it wont deter most.

Illinois has a 16 hr requirement and it hasnt deterred very many people at all. Even for out of state applicants.

Illinois even charges $150 application fee for residents and $300 for non-residents.

Not sure how you believe that’s not a deterrent, the time, or that amount. I believe that it very much is, and is just another way to infringe on a constitutional right. I’ve been through Chicago for business. If I had to spend any amount of time there I would very much want to be armed. And jump through the hoops to do it, if it was a reasonable process.

I had a buddy that was shot there, while exiting a restaurant. Statistically, the need for the of right self defense is at the very greatest in higher violent crime areas. But its restricted. How many others feel the same way and are deterred from going through the process? Not sure anyone can accurately answer that.

 

[Texasgrillchef]

Strongly disagree.

I’m not keen on making a fundamental right so burdensome. If minimal training gets us closer to being able to exercising our right of self defense, I’ll grumble a bit and do it.

Here in PA there is no training requirement. We seem to manage fine with the LTCF process, for the most part. There are a lot of people carrying in PA.

Thanks for helping those that need it receive the training.

I really dont think its a Deterrant as much as some people claim. Like i said Texas is a CC state so many could carry without training. However it seems classes are full of first timers wanting to learn.

I would like to believe that the majority of those who wish to carry either have had or want to get some type of training before they carry.

 

[Texasgrillchef]

I too agree.

While I believe training is an excellent idea and really should be undertaken for safety and efficacy, I believe more strongly that there should be NO mandatory conditions required to exercise a human right.

Not only is the travel, time and money investment in training an excessive burden and impediment to many people, but the associated record-keeping is yet another way to identify and list (register) anyone with firearms. Doesn't make sense to object to HQLs and FOIDs on principle, but then demand training for personal protection.

I never implied that i supported mandatory training. I dont.

I think any truly responsible adult who wishes to carry should have some form of training. I never implied formal training either. But some form of training in at least safe handling and use as a minimum.

But i dont believe 16hrs is really much of a Deterrent. Whats is though is the cost. Because that means two days of training, additional cost in renting a location to teach the class as well as additional pay for the instructor which increases cost of training and makes it harder for more people to afford.

Thankfully, at least in Texas, there are various places that do teach the Texas LTC class for free to those who cant afford the class. Sometimes these are sponsored by churches sometimes by other organizations. But sadly there are many more that want it that cant get in or afford it.

Thankfully, Texas is CC. However many forget that many CC states still have areas that require a permit. To name two states that do Is Texas and Maine

 

[TheOriginalMexicanBob]

Mandatory training should be nonexistent


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There's a difference between being mandated to have training and taking personal responsibility to receive training. The former should not be forced upon us by the government...the latter is incumbent on the individual to be responsible in exercising his rights.

 

[pcfixer]

Supreme Court of the United States Home

SOON!!

 

[FrankZ]

There's a difference between being mandated to have training and taking personal responsibility to receive training. The former should not be forced upon us by the government...the latter is incumbent on the individual to be responsible in exercising his rights.

Where'd they hide that like button?

 

[Inigoes]

nothing noteworthy released in the orders

Awaiting opinion count (If my math is right)
November - 1 (NY)
December - 6 (Dobbs v Jackson - Abortion), (Carson v Makin)
January - 4
February - 7 (WV v EPA - Chevron overreach - similar to bump stock)
March - 7
April - 10 (Kennedy v Bremerton), (Biden v Texas)
-----------------------
35

 

[clandestine]

If 16 hours of training is a deterrant to getting a permit, maybe you shouldn't really carry.

While I do support every state having CC. I still support everyone needing training.

That ensures you will never get my business or praise.

 

[Boxcab]

I've always claimed that if the 2A requires training and proof of knowledge in the subject, then things like voting should as well. Whomever gets elected can lead us into wars, depression, boarder crises, etc. Before one is allowed to vote, one should have a minimum of a passing grade in basic high school level history, civics, economics, international law and finally the historic analysis of our own Constitution.




.

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

 

[Bertfish]

There's a difference between being mandated to have training and taking personal responsibility to receive training. The former should not be forced upon us by the government...the latter is incumbent on the individual to be responsible in exercising his rights.

This

 

[Squaregrouper]

Where can I go to see decisions in real time? I've pulled up the USSC webpage.

 

[GTOGUNNER]

"The Court may announce opinions on the homepage beginning at 10 a.m. If more than one opinion will be issued, they will post in approximately ten minute intervals. The Court will not take the Bench." source https://www.supremecourt.gov/

 

[motorcoachdoug]

Im here at ScotusBlog

Announcement of orders and opinions for Monday, May 23 (complete) - SCOTUSblog

We live blogged as the court released orders from the May 19 conference and opinions in Morgan v. Sundance and Shinn v. Ramirez. Click here for a list of FAQs about opinion announcements.

www.scotusblog.com

 

[Inigoes]

Where can I go to see decisions in real time? I've pulled up the USSC webpage.

You can either scroll down to see the opinions, or click the "Opinions of the Court" link.

You need to refresh your pages to see the released opinions. The court takes about 15 minutes to read opinion before releasing the next.

 

[DC-W]

There will be at least one more opinion today.

 

[CrazySanMan]

F5...F5...F5...



Dang, skunked again.

 

[FrankZ]

Not today