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View Full Version : Muzzle brake timing


danb
September 22nd, 2016, 10:54 AM
Most advice, especially doled out here, is for a brake to time it at 9/3 o'clock. https://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=171677

If it has ports on top, 9-12-3 o'clock. With 24.8756 ft lbs of torque and Rocksett not loctite, naturally.

The consequences of not doing this seem vague. Bad Stuff Happens, or something.

However I have found a few sources that suggest offset timing. None other that Miculek, and a video by Tubbs as well.

about the 3 minute mark:
GC1N7iW-yRA?t=185


Miculek says to time it depending on whether the shooter is right or left handed.

Tubbs and another article I found says to time it based on the twist - i.e. time the brake to counter force due the rifle twist.

What do people think of this? Anyone do this? I cannot imagine the force due to the rotation of the barrel is big, I have never even noticed it. Maybe this is useful for a big caliber like 50 BMG or a tank.

Miculek advice seems more useful (time it based on shooting), but again, I cannot imagine it makes a big difference.

alucard0822
September 22nd, 2016, 11:17 AM
You can time or adjust a comp for lateral movement, plenty of shooters do. In many cases recoil pushes the rifle away from your support hand slightly, and some of the gas redirected to counter muzzle rise is used to counter lateral movement. That is where his idea comes from, but comps can vary quite a bit on how much force they push the muzzle down with. Clocking it a bit can work, but it can give too much lateral push, or increase muzzle rise, and then it works against you if you shoot from the other shoulder. Here is another way to tune for it http://www.brownells.com/GunTech/Custom-Tuning-the-Rolling-Thunder-Compensator/detail.htm?lid=14873.

Personally I shoot from weak side enough, and the M4-72 comp on my 18" 3gun rifle pretty much has 0 muzzle movement with my stance that I didn't bother clocking it, shot plenty of matches with it, and if my score is slow, it's not the rifle's fault. The Y I had on another rifle did have a tiny bit, I opened up the port a little on the right side and top, and it helped. Any benefit will vary substantially by the rifle, shooter, ammo and purpose.

smokey0118
September 29th, 2016, 10:27 AM
I'd say the best is to set up a camera with slow-mo(most cell-phones now) at about the 1 oclock position on a stand, or directly over the shooter's shoulder. Shoot a few shots like you normally do and see where the muzzle goes. I've found that some comps actually push down too much and press the muzzle down off-target rather than having it rise up off target. You should also be able to see if you need to cant the muzzle device in one direction or the other based on lateral movement. Everyone's different and now most guns are too. Gather observable data, make an adjustment...gather more data...and see what works for you.

danb
September 29th, 2016, 11:53 AM
A suggestion to collect observable data! And to adjust accordingly! On the internet! :whoa:

photoracer
September 29th, 2016, 10:59 PM
Jerry is correct because how you hold it will tend to offset the recoil and muzzle rise slightly non-vertical. That is why all the effective 3-gun comps have a few tiny holes on top and big ones on the side. Because too many big ones on top will actually drive the barrel down instead of keeping it flat. It needs to be offset a little to the side based on your hand hold on the rifle.

danb
September 30th, 2016, 08:31 PM
Well, new brake is shipping next week so we will see...

drive_accord_ingly
October 4th, 2016, 12:39 PM
Most advice, especially doled out here, is for a brake to time it at 9/3 o'clock. https://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=171677



about the 3 minute mark:
GC1N7iW-yRA?t=185

What do people think of this? Anyone do this? I cannot imagine the force due to the rotation of the barrel is big, I have never even noticed it. Maybe this is useful for a big caliber like 50 BMG or a tank. ....

Tanks don't need to time their muzzle breaks, the MRS and the Ballistic computer takes care of that.

clandestine
October 4th, 2016, 01:23 PM
Squaring the brake up is the baseline. You start there.

Fine tuning as shown by Jerry is something that 99 out of 100 shooters will never notice. Lots of guys who try that with threaded lock rings f up the threads.

Nice sarcasm in the O.P. about my previous advice.

clandestine
October 4th, 2016, 01:33 PM
Jerry is correct because how you hold it will tend to offset the recoil and muzzle rise slightly non-vertical. That is why all the effective 3-gun comps have a few tiny holes on top and big ones on the side. Because too many big ones on top will actually drive the barrel down instead of keeping it flat. It needs to be offset a little to the side based on your hand hold on the rifle.

Agreed.

Lots of people think big top ports on brakes are great to reduce muzzle rise on an AR. They dont realize that the human interface is what causes the muzzle to go up. The gun recoils straight back until the human interaction occurs.

I have experienced guns with heavy top porting on the brake, cause the muzzle to dip when fired.

Some people NEED lots of top porting because their shooting style or build does not manage recoil properly. Thus there is no one fits all brake.

EKing
October 4th, 2016, 01:57 PM
From what I've read, the idea of offset timing came out decades ago to help keep the rifle firmly in the support hand during automatic fire. Some 3-gunners may be doing this for the perceived advantage when they are doing rapid fire, but like another person said; most people won't notice a difference.

Streetgang
October 4th, 2016, 03:36 PM
Tanks don't need to time their muzzle breaks, the MRS and the Ballistic computer takes care of that.

Excellent advice. I'll remember that next time I shoot my Abrams, Leopard or Challenger.

danb
October 4th, 2016, 07:37 PM
Well, new brake is shipping next week so we will see...

... or, not. I guess the election rush is on.