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Old October 9th, 2011, 12:41 PM   #1
smokey0118
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Stuck omega breech plug

Jenni's uncle isnt the best at maintaining his firearms. He has a t/c omega with a very stuck and corroded breech plug. He said he typically uses bore butter on yhe plug threads, but he hadnt shot it in about a year and after shooting a dozen or so(without cleaning) the plug wouldnt come out. I now have a pretty rusty omega with a stuck breech plug. I poured some breakfree clp down the bore and from the breech side, and am waiting for that to penetrate. Aside from using a socket wrench + light hammer and heating the breech, what do I need to know to get this unstuck(i know the best way is to keep it clean/lubed and keep it from seizing in the first place.......buuuuut it is what it is).

Thanks guys


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Old October 9th, 2011, 01:27 PM   #2
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I'd have poured some Kroil down it first. I'm not sure how that will play with the CLP now though.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 02:25 PM   #3
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Is kroil that much better? I havent ever really used it before.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 02:26 PM   #4
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Is the weapon cleared? I despise Muzle Loaders. If you cant clear it scott can. Hes a master at that shit.

I had one blow up trying to dislodge a charge. Some dummy loaded 3 rounds and 3 charges. I soaked the bore in oil for a week. I was able to pull the front round and charge with a round puller, then I put a drive rod in the back of the gun (Aluminum) and started to tap the rounds out it. Well the compression or something set the ceter charge off. I heard a pfffffft and I ducked, not a second later a sabot fired out of the muzzle, the rond shot out the back and impaled the tolbox and the last round stayed in the bore somehow.

I have also had residue flash off after soaking the bores in oil when I heated them to remove stuck breach plugs.

If they are really stuck you have to dril the mout and use an E-Z out with an impact wrench to break it loose.

Oh god I hate muzzle loaders. I think I have an ulcer just thinkng about it.


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Clandestine, You're the reason gun owners are continually screwed over because you can't just shut up. You have to get a ruling as if to prove something. No doubt they will go with the most strict interpretation possible in regards to OAL. Not that I ever planned on doing business with you, but I will make sure that anyone who asks my opinion on your services doesn't go to you. You'll be solely responsible for the lousy method of measuring OAL resulting in wretched pinned muzzle devices.
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Old October 9th, 2011, 03:14 PM   #5
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Is the weapon cleared? I despise Muzle Loaders. If you cant clear it scott can. Hes a master at that shit.

I had one blow up trying to dislodge a charge. Some dummy loaded 3 rounds and 3 charges. I soaked the bore in oil for a week. I was able to pull the front round and charge with a round puller, then I put a drive rod in the back of the gun (Aluminum) and started to tap the rounds out it. Well the compression or something set the ceter charge off. I heard a pfffffft and I ducked, not a second later a sabot fired out of the muzzle, the rond shot out the back and impaled the tolbox and the last round stayed in the bore somehow.

I have also had residue flash off after soaking the bores in oil when I heated them to remove stuck breach plugs.

If they are really stuck you have to dril the mout and use an E-Z out with an impact wrench to break it loose.

Oh god I hate muzzle loaders. I think I have an ulcer just thinkng about it.
He said it's clear....putting the rod down it, it felt like there wasn't anything down there, so that's good. I'm just going to assume it's loaded an follow the safety rules until i can get the breech out and clear for certain. I was thinking a hair dryer should be able to get it hot enough to swell a bit without risk of lighting anything. It there anything i should know to help loosen it before smacking a socket wrench with a hammer to try to break it free? I gave it a hard turn with the stock breech plug wrench, but it wasn't budging after the ol' rob try.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 03:34 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokey0118 View Post
He said it's clear....putting the rod down it, it felt like there wasn't anything down there, so that's good. I'm just going to assume it's loaded an follow the safety rules until i can get the breech out and clear for certain. I was thinking a hair dryer should be able to get it hot enough to swell a bit without risk of lighting anything. It there anything i should know to help loosen it before smacking a socket wrench with a hammer to try to break it free? I gave it a hard turn with the stock breech plug wrench, but it wasn't budging after the ol' rob try.
Try to be sure to clear it first. Soaking it in oil and using heat afterward is the trick. Heat gun or hair dryer is too mild. A propane torch is needed.

I use a mixture of PB Blaster and Hoppes for the soak. I plug the nipple or peen it closed with a punch. I let it sit for a week like that. If you cant plug the nipple jus make a mix of one bottle of hoppes and a spray a whole can of PB into a cut off 20 ounce soda bottle and drop the action into it for a week.

Wipe it down and then add the heat get it smoking then stop and try the socket wrench with a long handle for leverage. An if that fdont work youll have to drill the breach plug and use an eazy out and impact wrench. If that dont work it will have to be plugged and an acid bath will have to be used in the very back of the blast chamber area. Its delicate work.


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Originally Posted by Abacab View Post
Clandestine, You're the reason gun owners are continually screwed over because you can't just shut up. You have to get a ruling as if to prove something. No doubt they will go with the most strict interpretation possible in regards to OAL. Not that I ever planned on doing business with you, but I will make sure that anyone who asks my opinion on your services doesn't go to you. You'll be solely responsible for the lousy method of measuring OAL resulting in wretched pinned muzzle devices.
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Old October 9th, 2011, 03:38 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clandestine View Post
Try to be sure to clear it first. Soaking it in oil and using heat afterward is the trick. Heat gun or hair dryer is too mild. A propane torch is needed.

I use a mixture of PB Blaster and Hoppes for the soak. I plug the nipple or peen it closed with a punch. I let it sit for a week like that. If you cant plug the nipple jus make a mix of one bottle of hoppes and a spray a whole can of PB into a cut off 20 ounce soda bottle and drop the action into it for a week.

Wipe it down and then add the heat get it smoking then stop and try the socket wrench with a long handle for leverage. An if that fdont work youll have to drill the breach plug and use an eazy out and impact wrench. If that dont work it will have to be plugged and an acid bath will have to be used in the very back of the blast chamber area. Its delicate work.
balls. Thanks chad


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Old October 9th, 2011, 03:41 PM   #8
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If your not sure that there is a charge in it - soak it with oil, and run some compressed air through the nipple with a soft tip air blower. That may blow out anything that is in it. Make sure the thing is pointed away from anything that should not be hit. If it just blows out air out of the muzzle, then you know its clear. They used to sell CO2 charged muzzleloader clearers, but if you have acsess to shop air, that probably would work better.

Muzzleloaders arent too bad - you just gotta keep on top of cleaning them, and unfortunatly, people dont like to do that.

Another thing - T/C warranties there guns for life - worst case scenario - contact T/C, and they may even remove the breech plug for you for free. Not sure what there policy is on lack of maintenence, but it wouldnst hurt to call them.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 03:47 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clandestine View Post
Is the weapon cleared? I despise Muzle Loaders. If you cant clear it scott can. Hes a master at that shit.

I had one blow up trying to dislodge a charge. Some dummy loaded 3 rounds and 3 charges. I soaked the bore in oil for a week. I was able to pull the front round and charge with a round puller, then I put a drive rod in the back of the gun (Aluminum) and started to tap the rounds out it. Well the compression or something set the ceter charge off. I heard a pfffffft and I ducked, not a second later a sabot fired out of the muzzle, the rond shot out the back and impaled the tolbox and the last round stayed in the bore somehow.

I have also had residue flash off after soaking the bores in oil when I heated them to remove stuck breach plugs.

If they are really stuck you have to dril the mout and use an E-Z out with an impact wrench to break it loose.

Oh god I hate muzzle loaders. I think I have an ulcer just thinkng about it.
Pyrodex is actually impact sensitve - its actually recommended that you dont tamp for that reason. Never understand why people tamp anyways.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 03:56 PM   #10
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Pyrodex is actually impact sensitve - its actually recommended that you dont tamp for that reason. Never understand why people tamp anyways.
I had exhausted every method. Drilling, Pulling, ect.... The first round wasnt charged with pyrodex. It was standard blackpoweder. This guy must have changed powders in between rounds. The sabots were also different brands as well once we recovered the fired ones.


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abacab View Post
Clandestine, You're the reason gun owners are continually screwed over because you can't just shut up. You have to get a ruling as if to prove something. No doubt they will go with the most strict interpretation possible in regards to OAL. Not that I ever planned on doing business with you, but I will make sure that anyone who asks my opinion on your services doesn't go to you. You'll be solely responsible for the lousy method of measuring OAL resulting in wretched pinned muzzle devices.
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Old October 9th, 2011, 03:56 PM   #11
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Is kroil that much better? I havent ever really used it before.
I think it will penetrate better than CLP. I've adopted dropping Kroil on any screws on old firearms and letting it soak in before I try to remove them. I've taken out many that I'm sure were in there for over a hundred years. That said, I defer to Chad's expertise.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 03:57 PM   #12
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I think it will penetrate better than CLP. I've adopted dropping Kroil on any screws on old firearms and letting it soak in before I try to remove them. I've taken out many that I'm sure were in there for over a hundred years. That said, I defer to Chad's expertise.
Kroll will work much better than CLP. You are spot on my friend.


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abacab View Post
Clandestine, You're the reason gun owners are continually screwed over because you can't just shut up. You have to get a ruling as if to prove something. No doubt they will go with the most strict interpretation possible in regards to OAL. Not that I ever planned on doing business with you, but I will make sure that anyone who asks my opinion on your services doesn't go to you. You'll be solely responsible for the lousy method of measuring OAL resulting in wretched pinned muzzle devices.
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Old October 9th, 2011, 04:02 PM   #13
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I had exhausted every method. Drilling, Pulling, ect.... The first round wasnt charged with pyrodex. It was standard blackpoweder. This guy must have changed powders in between rounds. The sabots were also different brands as well once we recovered the fired ones.
Was the guy high? Lol that pretty crazy. He must have been yaping his gums, while shooting, and not paying attention.

And actually both Black Powder, and Pyrodex, are impact sensitve. Have to be carefull of that.

At least he didnt leave the ramrod in the muzzle, when he went to fire it. I know a couple of dumbasses that did that.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 04:17 PM   #14
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Was the guy high? Lol that pretty crazy. He must have been yaping his gums, while shooting, and not paying attention.

And actually both Black Powder, and Pyrodex, are impact sensitve. Have to be carefull of that.

At least he didnt leave the ramrod in the muzzle, when he went to fire it. I know a couple of dumbasses that did that.
I think Hap Baker confiscates ramrods that are fired downrange and puts them in their little "Hall of Shame."
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Old October 9th, 2011, 04:18 PM   #15
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Was the guy high? Lol that pretty crazy. He must have been yaping his gums, while shooting, and not paying attention.

And actually both Black Powder, and Pyrodex, are impact sensitve. Have to be carefull of that.

At least he didnt leave the ramrod in the muzzle, when he went to fire it. I know a couple of dumbasses that did that.

Fudds, they never seem to care for their gear.

I didnt know blackpower was that volitale. I really despise muzzle loaders and I refuse to work on them unless Im forced to because most of the ones I see are VASTLY abused. I can count how many double loads I have seen. A few triple loads but they arent as common.

I dont do tham at all anymore. he ones that are all loaded up or rusted take all day to cear and remove the plug. People arent willing to pay for a Gunsmiths whole day for a $400 gun to be cleared and still be rusted and eaten once done.


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Clandestine, You're the reason gun owners are continually screwed over because you can't just shut up. You have to get a ruling as if to prove something. No doubt they will go with the most strict interpretation possible in regards to OAL. Not that I ever planned on doing business with you, but I will make sure that anyone who asks my opinion on your services doesn't go to you. You'll be solely responsible for the lousy method of measuring OAL resulting in wretched pinned muzzle devices.
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Old October 9th, 2011, 04:24 PM   #16
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I think Hap Baker confiscates ramrods that are fired downrange and puts them in their little "Hall of Shame."
LOL, the one I found on farm, where we used to shoot was bent into the letter "C". The guy was freaking senile, and glad he didnt hunt with us to be honest. The guy has since died though. He was a nice guy -just a couple beers short of a 6 pack.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 04:30 PM   #17
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Once you get the plug out. Tell him yo use anti-size lube.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 04:38 PM   #18
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Id also invest in a breech plug hole cleaner. T/C makes one that looks like a plastic "Tap" like you see in a tap & die set. Has grooves cut into it, to vent the fouling out of it. There actually made for the Omegas.

Gorilla Grease (anti seize for muzzleloaders), is pretty good for breechplugs. Ive always used bore butter, and never had an issue with a stuck breechplug.


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Old October 9th, 2011, 04:41 PM   #19
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thanks guys. I'm soakin up all the info you're giving here and trying to make an informed decision on things. I really do appreciate you taking the time to chime in here.


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Old October 10th, 2011, 08:19 PM   #20
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After letting the breakfree clp penetrate, I took everything apart and heated the breech over the gas stove until around 250 degrees or so(till spit on the finger sizzled). A few good whacks on the socket wrench was able to break everything loose and give me access to the nightmare that was the inside. Now everything is mirror clean on the inside and I bore-sighted the scope after remounting it. All that's left is function testing/final sight-in and it can go back(this time with a little teflon tape on the breech plug and a supply of cleaning tools).
2011-10-10 17.07.18.jpg

2011-10-10 17.14.57.jpg


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