A warning on carrying spring-assisted knives.

[buzzzyy]

Hey yall,


I know a lot of us like the spring assisted knives - they are very useful tools. I use mine many times a day. Well, I used to, before I had it confiscated by the cops.

I was questioned by some cops for a matter unrelated to the knife. In the middle of having a conversation with a couple of Hagerstown PD officers, one of them proceeded to yank the knife right from out of my pocket. It was hanging inside it by the clip, you know, how they are designed to hang.

Upon discovering that the knife was of the spring-assisted variety, I was cuffed and perp-walked to jail. I've been charged with having a concealed deadly weapon and now have to waste money on defending myself against this bogus charge. To add insult to injury, I was told that I am not getting the knife back ($120 benchmade) because it's now evidence and will have to take it up with CLEO if I have a problem with it.

I guess these local yokels don't know that first of all, a just because one can be injured with a knife does not make it a weapon. Just because G. Gordon Liddy can kill you with a #2 pencil by sticking it thru your eye into your brain, does not make the pencil a deadly weapon. And of course they don't know that spring assisted knives are not illegal.

[buzzzyy]

I gotta defend myself against a concealed dangerous weapon charge for having a pocket knife. Is something really concealed if it can been seen from a distance, without performing a search? See knife forum if you care.

Anyway, does anyone know a good lawyer that might go to Washington county?

Thanks.

[Cai]

I hope everything works out for you. On the bright side I think that the "yanking out of your pocket thing" is an illegal search. I'm not sure about that however... Best of luck!

[llkoolkeg]

What model Benchmade & do you have a picture? Was it truly a spring-assisted knife or was it an automatic knife? If you know that you're going to be speaking with any LEO, it makes good sense to empty your pockets beforehand of anything they might possibly find objectionable as many will want to pat you down "for their protection". I have been patted down prior to questioning before for no reason other than being out late at night...and I don't even look like a hoodlum.

[mpdc4511]

I always take knives away from people all the time. I mean I give them the knives back at the conclusion of my investigaton but thats if they aren't coming with me and no crime has been committed.

Did you check the local hagerstown laws there might be one in there about the weapon due to the way it was carried, size, or myabe it was the assisted opening.

I do agree however that sucks, I always have a knife......hahaha then again a lot of the times I have a gun.

Usually for that charge to stick there has to be some sort of time/place/circumstances surrounding the reason for carrying the knife. I understand not wanting to tell us the "unrelated matter" but I am assuming the "unrelated matter" could have lead up to the CDW charge. But then again just a guess from what I read since I wasn't there.

Hope everything works out for the better!

[mpdc4511]

Originally Posted by llkoolkeg

What model Benchmade & do you have a picture? Was it truly a spring-assisted knife or was it an automatic knife? If you know that you're going to be speaking with any LEO, it makes good sense to empty your pockets beforehand of anything they might possibly find objectionable as many will want to pat you down "for their protection". I have been patted down prior to questioning before for no reason other than being out late at night...and I don't even look like a hoodlum.

hoodlum!!

[llkoolkeg]

Originally Posted by mpdc4511

hoodlum!!

Ssssssssshhhh...you almost woke up my wife and spilled the beans!

[THier]

Not trying to stir up stuff,,, but what does this do to firearm ownership? I assume if convicted,, guns go bye-bye?

I wish you the best of luck!! Keep us informed.

Is a Leatherman in a sheath a CDW?

Tom

[mpdc4511]

laws like that are generally local in nature. In D.C. you can have a knife but if you have a knife during any sort of crime it can be considered "while armed". You can be panhandeling and if you have a pocket knife you can be charged with "panhandeling while armed" (no one ever does it and the courts would never prosecute but techinically you could). There are also other charges for having a knife event without the intent to use it as a weapon but they are time/place/circumstance related and take a lot of articulation and PC to get prosecuted.

Again buzzzy I don't know what the circumstances were but if you had my guess, it's something in regards to the unrelated matter. As police 99% of us carry knives with us. Hell I have one clipped to the cargo pocket of my BDU and one in my boot (total rambo I know) right now. There has to be more to this story than what we are being told. And thats fine I completly understand privacy I don't let you guys know that I own and LOVE my CZ 75b in .40, or that the moive John Q ALMOST made me sad, or that I may or may not carry a pink pen with me when I work...........crap did I just admit that.......

[Bart_man]

Originally Posted by mpdc4511

that I may or may not carry a pink pen with me when I work...........crap did I just admit that.......

LOL I knew you were a pinko!

Buzzy I carry a spring assisted knife at all times. Please keep us in the loop.

[WeaponsCollector]

If I'm going to get arrested for carrying a pocket knife, it might as well actually be illegal.
Maybe I should start carrying an evil switchblade or a scary assault gravity knife.
I've even got black ones.

[Ab_Normal]

Tell us the unrelated reason why you were stopped. I doubt the police would ever just yank you out of a crowd for a fishing expedition.

[EL1227]

I'd better be careful from now on ...

My 3" spring-assisted would definately be deemed 'a deadly weapon' because of all of the accumulated dirt and manure in it from carving stones out of my horse's hooves. Just one little nick from this baby and you're as good as gone from some rare contagion in 48-72 hours.

Good luck with your situation. Keep us knife-carriers posted on the outcome.

[Semper Noctem]

Originally Posted by Cai

I hope everything works out for you. On the bright side I think that the "yanking out of your pocket thing" is an illegal search. I'm not sure about that however... Best of luck!

Depending on the nature of the stop, the LEO would have probable cause to seach his person... Why were you stopped?

[Redcobra]

The more stuff like this I hear about, the more I distrust the Police.
Even if you are legal, they often, according to anecdotal evidence, violate your civil rights and make you deal with the legal system at your cost for any redress. Many people cannot afford this so simply become the victim through no fault of their own. In my opinion, there is no reason to be "patted down" just for walking around late at night unless there is a curfew. In my opinion, there is no reason to be searched for carrying a legal knife clipped to your pocket much less to have it taken from you by force when there is no legal reason to do so. In my opinion, Police seem to feel they have the right to do whatever they want, legal or not, and to then let the courts decide at the taxpayers and victims expense.
Enough.

I guess that one day I will be doing the "perp walk" for no legal reason, maybe for simply carrying a sailors knife (blade and marlin spike). I suppose that walking my German Shepherd Dog on a public street could be considered openly carrying or maintaining a deadly weapon. I, on the other hand have the means and the time to pursue redress through the system, and I will pursue the matter and litigate both criminally and civilly to the limits of the legal system.

[CrabbyMcNab]

Wow, certainly an interesting way to start the day. I always thought "spring-assisted" was legal in most states. Providing it's three inches or less? I agree with mpdc4511, If i was talking with individuals, keep your hands out of your pocket and can I hold onto your knife while we talk? If they were coming along, the knife gets held.

I know there are some crappy areas of Hagerstown, so i wonder about the circumstances.

[Name Taken]

Originally Posted by Redcobra

The more stuff like this I hear about, the more I distrust the Police.
Even if you are legal, they often, according to anecdotal evidence, violate your civil rights and make you deal with the legal system at your cost for any redress. Many people cannot afford this so simply become the victim through no fault of their own. There is no reason to be "patted down" just for walking around late at night unless there is a curfew. There is no reason to be searched for carrying a legal knife clipped to your pocket much less to have it taken from you by force when there is no legal reason to do so. Police seem to feel they have the right to do whatever they want, legal or not, and to then let the courts decide at the taxpayers and victims expense.
Enough.

I guess that one day I will be doing the "perp walk" for no legal reason, maybe for simply carrying a sailors knife. I, on the other hand have the means and the time to pursue redress through the system, and I will pursue the matter and litigate both criminally and civilly to the limits of the legal system.

Maybe before making crass decisions it would be better served to hear the ENTIRE story (like why the OP had an encounter with the officer). Second as always there is another side to the story.

Not calling the OP a liar by any means but I realize that someone is only going to post the part of the encounter that they feel is wrong.


And for lords sake if you dont have a basic understanding of reasonable suspicion, probable cause, and exceptions to search standards STOP POSTING LEGAL ADVICE OFF OF YOUR "I think" non sense.


To the OP...find your knife on a website and post your exact model please. Care to explain why you had an encounter with the police to begin with?

[Redcobra]

Originally Posted by Name Taken

Maybe before making crass decisions it would be better served to hear the ENTIRE story (like why the OP had an encounter with the officer). Second as always there is another side to the story.

Not calling the OP a liar by any means but I realize that someone is only going to post the part of the encounter that they feel is wrong.


And for lords sake if you dont have a basic understanding of reasonable suspicion, probable cause, and exceptions to search standards STOP POSTING LEGAL ADVICE OFF OF YOUR "I think" non sense.


To the OP...find your knife on a website and post your exact model please. Care to explain why you had an encounter with the police to begin with?

I offer no legal advice to anyone. I am not qualified to do so.

[Pushrod]

How is it possible to charge you with Concealed Deadly Weapon for a legal folder that is in your pocket. You really need to lawyer up, you don't want to lose your gun rights over a bogus charge.

Fill us in on the details, alot of us carry assisted-opening knives and don't want to befall this same fate.

[Name Taken]

Originally Posted by Redcobra

I offer no legal advice to anyone. I am not qualified to do so.

That part was not aimed at you....the first part was.

So far in the thread we have "the police need probable cause to search you" which is correct in the actual term. However to PAT YOU DOWN and TAKE A WEAPON which occured they dont need probable cause.

Someone else said folders shorter then a 3 inch blade are legal...wrong there is not length requirement.

These threads always get sideways because people "think" they know something that's very complexed and every changing which is the criminal justice system.