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Old June 28th, 2007, 10:33 AM   #1
K-Romulus
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New MSP form? "MSP 77R-3"

I got the MSI update and there was a blurb about some new mental health check form the MSP is now demanding from purchasers of regulated firearms.

Quote:
9) New form MSP 77R-3 (6-07)
By way of Ray:
To buy a regulated firearm in Maryland now you'll have to fill out another form -- one that gives the MSP access to your personal mental medical records.
Anyone hear of this? I am curious as to what it says. It sounds a lot like the New Jersey-style purchase permit process.
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Old June 28th, 2007, 10:40 AM   #2
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AGC is also looking into it, having sent FOIA requests to various people.
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Old June 28th, 2007, 10:41 AM   #3
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Since when this was established ? I had no idea about this, I dont have any mental issues but I was wondering why would this be in enforce now ? unless it was present somehow without our knowledge ?


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Old June 28th, 2007, 10:42 AM   #4
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Maybe eventually we will have to fill out so many forms we'll give up and not bother.
Its strange that to exercise a right guaranteed by the constitution we have to jump through so many hoops.


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Old June 28th, 2007, 10:46 AM   #5
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starting 8-1 we have to fax it in with all applications.

I'll grab one tonight and try to get it scaned in and posted tonight.
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Old June 28th, 2007, 10:56 AM   #6
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Public Information Act request

On June 21, 2007 the Maryland State Police Licensing Division mailed a letter to licensed firearms dealers informing them that in addition to Form 77R Part 1 and Part 2, persons wishing to purchase a regulated firearm must now complete a new form designated Form 77R-3.

By signing this form, the purchaser authorizes the Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, or any similar agency or department in another state to disclose to the Department of State Police any and all mental health information regarding the applicant. The authorization remains in force for 1 year unless the applicant submits a written request to revoke the authorization. There is nothing in the form to indicate that the Maryland State Police are required to comply with the request to revoke the authorization.

AGC is sending a Public Information Act request to Ms. Betty Stemley, Principal Counsel – Maryland State Police requesting information concerning the legality of the new 77R-3 form, and under what authority this form is being mandated.

A fax has also been sent to Congressman Ruppersberger’s office requesting information on whether or not this mandated release of medical records violates any federal laws.

I will distribute the MSP’s response when it is received.

In the interim, questions should be directed to the commander of MSP licensing 410-799-0191 x304. As always, remember to be polite and respectful.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
John H. Josselyn, Legislative Vice President
Associated Gun Clubs of Baltimore, Inc.
P. O. Box 20102
Towson, MD 21284-0102
410-296-3947
mailto:John H. Josselyn<agcbalto@bcpl.net>
http://www.associatedgunclubs.org


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Old June 28th, 2007, 10:58 AM   #7
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Another example of the powers that be granting themselves authority where none exists. Absent a new law, I fail to see how this can be leally done.

Given the precedent of our president granting himself power through executive orders, it's no wonder that they think they can get away with this.


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Old June 28th, 2007, 11:42 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norton View Post
Another example of the powers that be granting themselves authority where none exists. Absent a new law, I fail to see how this can be leally done.

Given the precedent of our president granting himself power through executive orders, it's no wonder that they think they can get away with this.
Anyone wanna bet that it came as a Gov Decree from His Majesty the Teflon Leprecaun?


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Old June 28th, 2007, 11:54 AM   #9
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Thanks, guys, this story will probably turn out to be a doozy. Buckle up!!!!
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Old June 28th, 2007, 02:29 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpk1md View Post
Anyone wanna bet that it came as a Gov Decree from His Majesty the Teflon Leprecaun?
It's about his speed. Makes up crime stats, turned 12 years into 20 for former police commissioner and personal friend, magically increased the value of a friend's property... hell, why not make up your own "laws"? He is King, after all. Who's going to stop him? The people of Maryland? They elected that giant turd, Governor.

Everyone, say a little prayer. "Help us, Jeebus. Why hast thou forsaken us? What did we do, to deserve this plague you have set upon us?"
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Old June 28th, 2007, 03:16 PM   #11
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more info

MDALert has a copy of the form uploaded. Here is the salient portion:

Quote:
I (name, address, etc.) authorize the Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, or any other similar agency or
department of another state, to disclose to the Department of State Police information limited to
whether I suffer from a mental disorder as defined in § 10-101(f)(2) of the Health--General
Article and have a history of violent behavior against anyone; or whether I have been confined
for more than 30 consecutive days to a mental health facility as defined in § 10-101 of the
Health--General Article.

I acknowledge that this information will be used, solely as part of the investigation required by
Title 5, Subtitle 1 of the Public Safety Article, Annotated Code of Maryland, to determine my
eligibility to possess a regulated firearm. In the event that my application to purchase a regulated
firearm is disapproved, I acknowledge that this authorization and any information obtained via
this authorization may be used in any proceeding relating to such disapproval.
I further acknowledge that I may at any time, except to the extent that the Department of State
Police has already taken action in reliance on it, revoke this authorization by submitting a request
for revocation in writing. If not previously revoked, this authorization will terminate one year
after the date I sign this application or upon notification to me of the denial of this application,
whichever occurs first.
The relevant definition from the Health-general statute is:
Quote:
Title 10. Mental Hygiene Law

Subtitle 1. Definitions; General Provisions
>>§ 10-101. Definitions

. . .
(f)(1) "Mental disorder" means a behavioral or emotional illness that results from a psychiatric or neurological disorder.

(2) "Mental disorder" includes a mental illness that so substantially impairs the mental or emotional functioning of an individual as to make care or treatment necessary or advisable for the welfare of the individual or for the safety of the person or property of another.
I believe they will claim that the form is to enforce the following part of the "regulated firearm law":

Quote:
Title 5. Firearms

Subtitle 1. Regulated Firearms (Refs & Annos)

>>§ 5-133. Restrictions on possession of regulated firearms

. . .
Possession of regulated firearm prohibited


(b) A person may not possess a regulated firearm if the person:
. ..
(6) suffers from a mental disorder as defined in § 10-101(f)(2) of the Health--General Article and has a history of violent behavior against the person or another, unless the person has a physician's certificate that the person is capable of possessing a regulated firearm without undue danger to the person or to another;

(7) has been confined for more than 30 consecutive days to a facility as defined in § 10-101 of the Health--General Article, unless the person has a physician's certificate that the person is capable of possessing a regulated firearm without undue danger to the person or to another . . .
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Old June 28th, 2007, 05:06 PM   #12
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Old June 28th, 2007, 05:19 PM   #13
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I noticed the big line for a social security number. Will that be required, or optional as it is on the 4473's?
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Old June 28th, 2007, 05:31 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpk1md View Post
Anyone wanna bet that it came as a Gov Decree from His Majesty the Teflon Leprecaun?
Nail on the head
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Old June 28th, 2007, 05:34 PM   #15
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Anyone want to bet on whats considered a "mental disorder"?


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Old June 28th, 2007, 06:01 PM   #16
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"Mental Disorder" means absolutely anything defined in the DSM-IV that psychologists use, which means just about anything. Even Attention Deficit Disorder fits. I don't think "history of violent behavior" is so easily defined. But we all know how strictly this administration will interpret it. I'm sure an obscene gesture in traffic is enough to tip the scales in their eyes.

Isn't it funny this comes out just two weeks after O'Sleezy fired a good man who was running the state police and replaced him with his puppet Sheridan?
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Old June 28th, 2007, 06:14 PM   #17
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http://www.mdsp.org/downloads/77R-3.pdf

http://mlis.state.md.us/2007RS/subjects/guns.htm

Email Away to Fox news and Bill O

VT fallout New Maryland Mental Health Release Form

"On June 21, 2007 the Maryland State Police Licensing Division mailed a letter to licensed firearms dealers informing them that in addition to Form 77R Part 1 and Part 2, persons wishing to purchase a regulated firearm must now complete a new form, designated Form 77R-3.

By signing this form, the purchaser authorizes the Department of Health and Mental Hygiene, or any similar agency or department in another state, to disclose to the Department of State Police any and all mental health information regarding the applicant. The authorization remains in force for 1 year unless the applicant submits a written request to revoke the authorization. There is nothing in the form to indicate that the Maryland State Police is required to comply with the request to revoke the authorization."


To my knowledge this law was not passed by the house, senate or signed by the Governor, so on who's authority was it enacted?
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Old June 28th, 2007, 08:54 PM   #18
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So, if i was diagnosed with depression and ADHD when I was a kid, but no longer take meds or see a therapist or anything, I can't get registered weapons?

Ok, time to stock up on C&R I guess...


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Old June 29th, 2007, 03:53 AM   #19
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So if this does not go into effect until aug 1st then gun dealers should not be telling people that this form need to be filled out in order to buy right?
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Old June 29th, 2007, 07:44 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loxety View Post
So if this does not go into effect until aug 1st then gun dealers should not be telling people that this form need to be filled out in order to buy right?
No, they should be shouting it from the rooftops to incite people to buy now.

Although with MD's one gun a month law, it really won't produce a huge boost in sales.......
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