Handgun Board Update

rseymorejr · May 17, 2015

danb said:
Why do we still have this. It takes up resources, and guns are rarely declined.

Anything that creates a hassle for law abiding citizens is a plus in their minds.

swinokur · May 18, 2015

IIRC one of the members of the board is supposed to be an engineer. Not that that would qualify anyone to make determinations about product design, safety or quality.

erwos · May 18, 2015

BigDaddy said:
He submitted a BUL Storm in April. He was asking about submitting something else, but it was not Israeli,my mistake.

Actually, due to a shipping screwup, it did not make it in April. The other guns I want to put on are the remaining Kareen variants (which are Israeli made).

FFJim · May 18, 2015

Omega21 said:
Ms. Jenkins indicated that one of the key board members will not be available in May, so the next board meeting is going to be in late June.

Saw this part and was wondering how this impacts those of us waiting for a certain handgun (Glock 43) to be approved. I have been hearing they would be voted on at the meeting in May then available for purchase in June after the 30 day waiting period. Does this mean things are pushed back another month?

erwos · May 18, 2015

FFJim said:
Saw this part and was wondering how this impacts those of us waiting for a certain handgun (Glock 43) to be approved. I have been hearing they would be voted on at the meeting in May then available for purchase in June after the 30 day waiting period. Does this mean things are pushed back another month?

Yes, this pushes it back another month. Whether they reopen the submission period is a better question.

lamontjb · May 18, 2015

My mpw from aac was added to the board today. Wehoo

Schipperke · May 18, 2015

Applehd said:
Smoke and mirrors...
Absolutely no need for the HRB...

They did save everyone from the Remington R51 :lol2:

edisthera · May 18, 2015

Wait the meeting has been pushed back?

Let me see if I understand this correctly. We have a board of people that are placed as gatekeepers in the state to approve/deny firearms for the entire state. They can take a day off and delay the process of buying a handgun for the entire state a month or two? There's no system in place to replace them as needed? How in the hell can one person have that much power over citizens in the state of Maryland? Most government offices have several layers for this reason.

Now I know if they ban a gun it won't ever be unbanned. Given that, is there a way we as a community can really put together an effort and get as many newer guns on the roster as possible? If we're forced to be months behind the rest of the country because they can't substitute one person on the board or have provisions for dealing with something like this. They should be forced to have to deal with the volume of people who will be submitting applications in.

I already submitted every single new Chiappa Rhino caliber recently added in every size.
I'll call Coonan and see if they can add the Coonan compact as well and send them a sample.

The process is not hard and any one of us can fill out the paperwork. Marlene is a wonderful woman and I believe we need to push these people and make them earn that paycheck.

erwos · May 18, 2015

First of all, it's unclear to me that the members of the roster board get paid at all. It's certainly not their full time job.

Second, they don't ban anything. They do not have that statutory authority, even though they like to pretend they do. There are ways, awkward as they are, of getting guns that are not roster approved.

My fear is that if we start spamming the roster board, they'll push back by demanding samples of everything. If you want some model of gun that's not on there, sure, try petitioning it... but I wouldn't waste the time on just random stuff for completeness. I understand the frustration, I got screwed one time when they cancelled like three meetings in a row. The law should have specified a maximum wait time before automatic approval. But, it doesn't, and so here we are.

What's really BS is cancelling the meeting for one person. A quorum for them is six people out of ten. They could have gone forward.

I see the cut-off date was extended, so maybe I'll get the form from Marlene and see if I can't get the other Kareen variants on there.

edisthera · May 18, 2015

erwos said:
First of all, it's unclear to me that the members of the roster board get paid at all. It's certainly not their full time job.

Second, they don't ban anything. They do not have that statutory authority, even though they like to pretend they do. There are ways, awkward as they are, of getting guns that are not roster approved.

My fear is that if we start spamming the roster board, they'll push back by demanding samples of everything. If you want some model of gun that's not on there, sure, try petitioning it... but I wouldn't waste the time on just random stuff for completeness.

I understand they may do just that. But I also find it hard to believe they have had so few guns added every so months.

~33 In April 2015

I was told when I called they had the authority to ban thus my parroting what I was told. New models at the very least which have great interest and often sell out are likely going to be requested. My total shot in the dark guess is most people don't submit because they either don't know how or think it's harder than it is.

I guess my point is they're playing on the average uninformed joe's ignorance and laziness in making that list short and the time between meetings long.

erwos · May 18, 2015

They can claim whatever they want. They cannot ban anything, period, end of story.

Most people don't submit because it's a pain in the ass to wait 2-4 months and pay shipping to get a handgun. That means the people submitting are usually manufacturers, dealers, or (semi-)serious collectors. Manufacturers and dealers aren't going out of their way to submit old stuff for the hell of it, so that leaves (semi-)serious collectors.

The number of guns added per month is hardly surprising, and has been stable for a while. You'd be better off quietly supporting legislation that would remove the roster for financial reasons rather than trying to game the system, which isn't going to work as well as you think. Given the roster board's propensity to approve damn near anything, I doubt there's some sort of conspiracy to screw us out of Glock 43s for another month. It's just the usual friction of trying to get a bunch of people in a room at once while not paying them to do so.

Omega21 · May 24, 2015

erwos said:
First of all, it's unclear to me that the members of the roster board get paid at all. It's certainly not their full time job.

What's really BS is cancelling the meeting for one person. A quorum for them is six people out of ten. They could have gone forward.

correct, board members have other jobs, this is just an additional role they fill. Your second statement is generally correct, but Marlene indicated there are 3 members who MUST participate in every board meeting and it's those individuals' absence that delayed the board in this instance I referred to in my OP. That said, I agree that it's BS - and I'm as frustrated as others - that the board gets canceled so frequently. That said, I can't argue that the company I work for is much more efficient...

edisthera said:
My total shot in the dark guess is most people don't submit because they either don't know how or think it's harder than it is.

...they're playing on the average uninformed joe's ignorance and laziness in making that list short and the time between meetings long.

While I agree with the first statement that most believe it's harder than it is, I agree with erwos, there is not conspiracy here to keep the list short or delay meetings, this is just organizational inefficiency and bureaucracy doing what bureaucracy does best...

erwos said:
They can claim whatever they want. They cannot ban anything, period, end of story.

When the board doesn't approve a handgun, isn't that de facto banning it from sale in the state? Technicalities of statutory authority aside, if it's not approved then what is it?

ras_oscar · May 24, 2015

Rack&Roll said:
The next office over is the Preacher Roster Review Board, where they meet to look at divinity degrees to see who in Maryland should be able to counsel those who say "the Devil made me do it!".

That office is run by an absolutely lovely lady named Miss Geraldine Jones, who is an atrocious flirt, so watch out.

Is that down the hall from the candidate for the Maryland General Assembly registration office? I believe they do a US constitution quiz and a Background check. :innocent0

jtg.1983 · Jun 4, 2015

More fun Roster encounters...

On a whim I put in a bid on a Taurus Curve, and it was shipped to my friendly FFL holder, and when I went to take possession we discovered it was not on the stupid roster.
I swear the only time I interact with my wonderful state government is when it is relieving me of what is mine or thwarting my desires. It is exceedingly vexing.

erwos · Jun 4, 2015

FWIW, I petitioned the Kareen and Kareen MkIII, and they demanded samples, even after the application specifically noted that the guns are mechanically identical to existing guns on the roster.

When the board doesn't approve a handgun, isn't that de facto banning it from sale in the state? Technicalities of statutory authority aside, if it's not approved then what is it?

It's banning it from sale in the state. That doesn't mean you can't receive it as a gift or inheritance, or possess it after moving in from another state.

BeoBill · Jun 4, 2015

Omega21 said:
You know I was thinking about this as I was doing my paperwork. If the criteria of cheap Saturday night specials were really true then there's a much much simpler way to go about keeping those off the streets to protect the children. But, I agree with all of you that this is simply unnecessary bureaucratic red tape that has little value to anyone.

It's more "feel good" Security Theater that keeps one more person employed by the state. I wonder how much it costs to staff and maintain that office?

Engine4 · Jul 2, 2015

jtg.1983 said:
On a whim I put in a bid on a Taurus Curve, and it was shipped to my friendly FFL holder, and when I went to take possession we discovered it was not on the stupid roster.

Is the Curve on the roster yet?

Omega21 · Jul 4, 2015

no, and I don't know if anyone submitted it prior to the June mtg. You would have to submit a sample for that for sure. jtg.1983 you up for that?

rico903 · Jul 4, 2015

I sincerely doubt these people work for free. I'm guessing it's one of the few remaining patronage jobs, doled out as a political favor. Like a street lamp inspector or liquor board member. I actually have friends who had these "jobs".
I'm sure many of you remember that MD was the last state in the country with a film review board. Mary Avera had sole ability to determine what movies could be shown in MD, or were effectively banned. We were the laughing stock of the country and the brunt of many jokes.

erwos · Jul 10, 2015

Annnnnnnnd the list has been published to the register:
http://www.dsd.state.md.us/MDR/4214/Assembled.htm#_Toc424030800

Highlights:
1. Sig MPX
2. Ruger 22 Charger Takedown
3. Chiappa Rhino (various models)
4. HK P2000
5. HK USP Tactical
6. Arsenal Strike One
7. Arsenal AF2011 A1 (because you needed a double-barreled 1911)

Also, a little known pistol called the Glock 43. And my BUL Storm.

They'll be available for sale on August 10.

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