SAF SUES IN MARYLAND OVER HANDGUN PERMIT DENIAL UPDATED 3-5-12

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    Soda

    Active Member
    Dec 14, 2010
    782
    Without G&S the MSP has to rely on cold hard facts.

    Until the State Legislature enacts other restrictions that are not related to G&S. Then we're back to square one. Hopefully that doesn't happen.

    I'm pretty sure I'm going to apply for my permit to get it in the queue and help demonstrate desire to the State. I think I may wait to see what the plaintiff's response is next Friday though. As others have said, the State is going to sit on any applications that use 2A as a G&S reason until (at least) the stay part of the process is exhausted. That means we wait for Legg's response to their stay request and then the 4th C response to a stay request if they don't get a stay from Legg. If a stay is granted at any point then those applications will sit for a loooooong time.
     

    Glaug-Eldare

    Senior Member
    BANNED!!!
    Jan 17, 2011
    1,837
    Quite right. If the Woollard judgment is affirmed on appeal to a final conclusion, the state will no longer be able to apply 5(ii), regardless of whether they change the law or not. I do not believe that the State of Maryland will defy a federal court judgment. That would be insanely stupid. This ain't Alabama in the '60s and the Governor is not George Wallace.

    The parallels are closer than they might seem...but Obama ain't no Eisenhower.
     

    esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,407
    Where does everyone keep getting this 50,000 applications number?

    It's a rough, very rough, estimate based on the percentage of a permit holders in other states with "shall issue" laws. The citizens of Maryland have been cowed for a long time with respect to 2A rights (the State constitution, almost uniquely among the states, does not have a 2A counterpart and thus it took Heller and McDonald to create a right to keep and bear arms in MD). But, we will catch up in due time. Maybe even very quickly with the Woollard ruling.
     

    Inigoes

    Head'n for the hills
    MDS Supporter
    Dec 21, 2008
    49,365
    SoMD / West PA
    Straight from the horse's mouth via a delegate

    The short answer is the state has a few more motions to go with the judge. The constituent's questions cannot be answered until the judge clarifies his order and provides additional guidance. We hope to have more answers in the next few weeks.
    Tom
     

    BenL

    John Galt Speaking.
    What people are failing to realize is the the "G&S reason" is the only subjective filter the MSP can rely on to keep the serfs in line.

    Without G&S the MSP has to rely on cold hard facts.

    What about the references? How would talking to my neighbor effect their decision? What if my neighbor thinks I have shifty eyes and I get denied based on that?

    I think the references request is another avenue to deny you.
     

    esqappellate

    President, MSI
    Feb 12, 2012
    7,407
    Many think otherwise.
    They are already defying a federal ruling, what's another?

    If you mean Woollard, the short answer is that legally they are *not* defying the court. They are actually following established post-judgment procedures with a 59(e) motion and a motion for a stay. Legally the state is doing what it is entitled to do to litigate in defense of a state statute. Thus far, at least, there is no basis for saying that the State is proceeding in bad faith in this litigation.
     

    teratos

    My hair is amazing
    MDS Supporter
    Patriot Picket
    Jan 22, 2009
    59,775
    Bel Air
    What about the references? How would talking to my neighbor effect their decision? What if my neighbor thinks I have shifty eyes and I get denied based on that?

    I think the references request is another avenue to deny you.

    You would probably be denied based on your neighbors opinion. YOU choose the reference. If someone you consider close doesn't trust you, the MSP sure has hell won't.

    Of course, when MD really goes "Shall-Issue" this is going to have to go away. The MSP doesn't have the manpower to call 3 references and have a face to face interview with every applicant.
     

    Gray Peterson

    Active Member
    Aug 18, 2009
    422
    Lynnwood, WA
    If you mean Woollard, the short answer is that legally they are *not* defying the court. They are actually following established post-judgment procedures with a 59(e) motion and a motion for a stay. Legally the state is doing what it is entitled to do to litigate in defense of a state statute. Thus far, at least, there is no basis for saying that the State is proceeding in bad faith in this litigation.

    The above is correct. Without an order specifically injuncting them or directing them to specifically do something, their position is that they can still apply G&S. There was another email posting here about them not denying people (which is a smart move on their part), they're going to sit on the apps until the 59(e) process is complete in regards to the clarification. Once that is done, and assuming a stay is NOT granted by either the district court or the 4th circuit, they must proceed with the judge's actual orders that come out of this 59(e) motion. esqappellate knows what he's talking about.

    After the judge issues his 59(e) clarification, that is when we can consider policing the MSP in regards to their processing. Not a minute before.
     

    fightinbluhen51

    "Quack Pot Call Honker"
    Oct 31, 2008
    8,974
    Mailed my VA non-res application today. Anyone have any idea how long it will take. My background is super clean
    I had mine in a month. That was roughly two summers ago.

    I had a receipt letter within a week of mailing it off. VA is nice as far as getting a permit.
     
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