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I am of the same belief as you, its just a hunk of aluminum with a permission slip.
The hunk of aluminum was allowed to be a ALG before the permission slip, it should be one after.
No more SBRs
- Thread starter Butcher
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I am of the same belief as you, its just a hunk of aluminum with a permission slip.
The hunk of aluminum was allowed to be a ALG before the permission slip, it should be one after.
bobthefisher
Durka ninja
That's basically right. This has been backed up by people getting pre Oct 1st lowers certified by MSP to build a firearm less then 29" in OAL, even way after Oct 1st. So if MSP is signing off on it, it would be a pretty good assumption that it's legal. Even Cpl Edwards, at MSP has stated the same to others on this forum. But yes, you cannot make a now banned item, more banned. However, be prepared to provide a "purchase order" or copy of the 77R when sending the Form 1 to the ATF, so you can prove you owned it before Oct 1st. You just had the pleasure of not going through that mess.
- Jul 29, 2014
- 49,995
I have an NFA trust and want to "build a sbr". I was told there is a minimum OAL in Maryland for sbrs. As far as I know, it is still legal to build your own for "personal use" in this manner.
Yes but OAL > 29" to be approved.
Bertfish
Throw bread on me
Can't you just file with an OAL of 29" and replace the upper with a shorter one once you get approval? As I understand it you need to always have possession of components to make it in to the original configuration but can change the barrel length once approved.
IANAL but IMO no. You'd be making an illegal copycat.
Just my opinion.
Just my opinion.
The ATF wouldn't care, but state and local cops would if you had an OAL of less than 29" while in Maryland.
That's no different than buying a new complete HBAR rifle and swapping in a lighter barrel... you're assembling a banned configuration.
As Nate has explained, if you didn't actually possess the <29" SBR before Oct 1, you could not possess it after Oct 1.
That's my understanding of this. MSP has told BATF not to approve anything after Oct. 1 with an OAL < 29". I interpret this to mean if you didn't actually possess it before Oct 1, it's illegal to posses now.
IANAL
That's my understanding of this. MSP has told BATF not to approve anything after Oct. 1 with an OAL < 29". I interpret this to mean if you didn't actually possess it before Oct 1, it's illegal to posses now.
IANAL
If you submit the form 1 with a 77r from pre-10/1, the OAL and other copycat requirements will supposedly be waived.
sleev-les
Gata Needs His Gat
I submitted my purchase order with mine from pre 10/01. I was still told nothing under 29". I asked about the 77r, but got the same response so I didnt submit it. ATF stated it doesn't matter when the lower was purchased, it had to be >29" OAL or would be disapproved.
Hell, BATFE kicked mine back to Engage even though MSP signed my Form 4 on Sept 12th, and OAL was 30.5 inches. It delayed everything by 2 weeks.
Go figure
Go figure
Presumably if it's a pre-10/1 receiver, though, one could put on a 7.5" upper (once an appproved F1/F4 is in hand) and not be committing any illegal acts, correct?
According to NATE IIRC if a copycat is not possessed before 10-1, then it's illegal to possess it after 10-1. I think that's what he postulated. Point being the lower isn't a copycat before 10-1. I believe putting a 7.5 inch upper on the lower after 10-1 would be prohibited.
IANAL.
IANAL.
- Feb 4, 2013
- 28,175
Wonder if you SBRd it before Oct 2013 with a 10.5" barrel. Would a 7.5" be legal to put on it now, as it was an SBR pre-Oct????
I don't think so. before 10-1-there was no such thing as a copycat. You'd be making a copycat after 10-1 if it's OAL < 29". The SBR part isn't relevant.
But IANAL
ETA-I posed this exact question to Nate. I have a 10.5" SBR I have a Form 4 on that MSP signed off on 9-12. I asked about putting a 7.5 300 BLK upper on it. I didn't take it as legal advice, nor was it offered as such, but since he is a lawyer, I took it as friendly , smart, good advice..
He said it was a bad idea. YMMV
But IANAL
ETA-I posed this exact question to Nate. I have a 10.5" SBR I have a Form 4 on that MSP signed off on 9-12. I asked about putting a 7.5 300 BLK upper on it. I didn't take it as legal advice, nor was it offered as such, but since he is a lawyer, I took it as friendly , smart, good advice..
He said it was a bad idea. YMMV
pablo
Backpfeifengesicht
Any ruling from MSP on whether a pre 10/1 SBR purchase has to be on the "roster"?
If it was sold and you possessed it before 10-1, to the best of my knowledge, no.
But iANAL either.
But iANAL either.
pablo
Backpfeifengesicht
That's what I thought as well. Purchased in Dec '12, form 4 filed in Jan '13, just got the approval. FFL won't release. Trying to confirm with MSP. It so far no joy.
Did you physically posses the SBR before 10-1? If it's at the dealer and it's needs to be transferred now, then yes it has to be on the roster. I misunderstood your post. I just picked up my SBR from Engage on July 19th. The 77r is filled out wjhen your Form 4 comes back so yes i needs to be on the roster. The Engage lower is on the roster.
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