Cleo sign offs can be tricky

vwluv10338 · Mar 24, 2015

http://truthvoice.com/2015/03/former-sheriff-deputy-sentenced-to-five-years-in-federal-prison/

Bertfish · Mar 24, 2015

So he forged the CLEO's signature so that he could buy a 416?

IMBLITZVT · Mar 24, 2015

So let me get this right, he hurt no one. Stole from no one. No victim in the case. Certainly guilty of being foolish. Basically for forging a signature with the knowledge of the person who he was forging? Not using public money to buy a cop a MG. No grand plans of mass murder with what he should have legally be allowed to buy anyway according to 2A.

This is the kind of insane stuff you hear about and then wonder who's side justice is on. There are people who murder people getting off easier. I sure wish I had been on the jury! However something tells me there is a lot of stuff going on behind the curtain on this one. Where is that GD blue line on something like this?

gabe72 · Mar 24, 2015

Wow read the comments below the article,def some cop haters there.

vwluv10338 · Mar 24, 2015

gabe72 said:
Wow read the comments below the article,def some cop haters there.

Probably because I pulled the article off the group "Cop Block" that my friend belongs to.

j_h_smith · Mar 24, 2015

I think there must be a lot more to this story.

Inigoes · Mar 24, 2015

IMBLITZVT said:
So let me get this right, he hurt no one. Stole from no one. No victim in the case. Certainly guilty of being foolish. Basically for forging a signature with the knowledge of the person who he was forging? Not using public money to buy a cop a MG. No grand plans of mass murder with what he should have legally be allowed to buy anyway according to 2A.

This is the kind of insane stuff you hear about and then wonder who's side justice is on. There are people who murder people getting off easier. I sure wish I had been on the jury! However something tells me there is a lot of stuff going on behind the curtain on this one. Where is that GD blue line on something like this?

Forgery is still a crime in itself.

Apparently, the Sheriff did not approve of the Machine Guns.

swinokur · Mar 24, 2015

squirrels said:
What exactly is the "National Firearms Registration and Transfer Record"??

Is that just for NFA things? If not, I think we have a problem here...

Yes, it is the Federal registry established in 1934 by the Nation Firearms Act (NFA) for MG, SBR, SBS, AOW, DD and silencers. Administered by the NFA Branch of BATFE in Martinsburg, WV.

When you see the discussion of Form 1, Form 4, Form 3, Form 5 etc they are the forms used to transfer and register different NFA items.

SRD · Mar 24, 2015

The Deputy was a Major?? :shocked3:

rob-cubed · Mar 24, 2015

So he forged his boss's signature and bought himself a post-86 sample by way of the police department?

I don't think he deserves five years in a Fed pen, but... play stupid games... this was definitely worse than just forging CLEO approval on something he could legally own.

As badly as I want an M16, there are some lines you just don't cross.

ROBAR35 · Mar 24, 2015

rob-cubed said:
So he forged his boss's signature and bought himself a post-86 sample by way of the police department?

I don't think he deserves five years in a Fed pen, but... play stupid games... this was definitely worse than just forging CLEO approval on something he could legally own.

As badly as I want an M16, there are some lines you just don't cross.

Exactly right :thumbsup:

and I'm certain when it got into the hands of the ATF the HK 416 threw up a red flag when it wasn't being transferred to a dealer or LE Agency being way post 1986.

j_h_smith · Mar 24, 2015

I didn't think a Post May MG could be transferred to an individual. Am I wrong?

Inigoes · Mar 24, 2015

j_h_smith said:
I didn't think a Post May MG could be transferred to an individual. Am I wrong?

It can per se.

A SOT wih LE letter. Depends how they setup the company.

The post 86 gun could have went to the Sheriffs department, not the major. Then the Major could have signed out the gun, and did whatever he pleased.

j_h_smith · Mar 24, 2015

Inigoes said:
It can per se.

A SOT wih LE letter. Depends how they setup the company.

The post 86 gun could have went to the Sheriffs department, not the major. Then the Major could have signed out the gun, and did whatever he pleased.

That's correct, but the MG is owned by the LE, not the individual.

IMBLITZVT · Mar 25, 2015

Inigoes said:
Forgery is still a crime in itself...

Sure, I can see that. Maybe a few days, weeks in jail... but 5 years?

As far as it being a post sample... yeah this guy was playing with fire.

Aren't these forgings called secretarial signatures? If his boss knew he was signing and was done so with his approval?

However I still say, no victim, no threats, no evil plans, nothing morally wrong other then lying when forging the signature. Something that should be protected by 2A. Nothing broken but Malum prohibitum law... that should not be getting a half decade jail sentence much less in these times when no one is getting the time they should. I mean Michael Vick gets what, 2 years? This to me was not worse than that? Think how long 5 years is! Is that justice? I say no.

It bugs me that people in cases like this say well be broke the law basically saying that whatever he gets it justified. First I would argue the Government is infringing on his 2A rights. So right there, I am on his side. This idea that he broke some petty law and was stupid and so deserves no defense to me just sounds crazy. What he did wrong should not have been needed anyway. Just because its law, does not make it right or just.

swinokur · Mar 25, 2015

The rabid antis running the govt make sure their ideology trickles down to both the courts and to prosecutors.

stupid game. stupid prize.

Inigoes · Mar 25, 2015

IMBLITZVT said:
Sure, I can see that. Maybe a few days, weeks in jail... but 5 years?

As far as it being a post sample... yeah this guy was playing with fire.

Aren't these forgings called secretarial signatures? If his boss knew he was signing and was done so with his approval?

However I still say, no victim, no threats, no evil plans, nothing morally wrong other then lying when forging the signature. Something that should be protected by 2A. Nothing broken but Malum prohibitum law... that should not be getting a half decade jail sentence much less in these times when no one is getting the time they should. I mean Michael Vick gets what, 2 years? This to me was not worse than that? Think how long 5 years is! Is that justice? I say no.

It bugs me that people in cases like this say well be broke the law basically saying that whatever he gets it justified. First I would argue the Government is infringing on his 2A rights. So right there, I am on his side. This idea that he broke some petty law and was stupid and so deserves no defense to me just sounds crazy. What he did wrong should not have been needed anyway. Just because its law, does not make it right or just.

Signature authority is normally handed down (delegated) in writing for it to be legal. It's cases like this: where people have short memories, if they can get into trouble.

The Major could have gotten a harsher sentence, he could have been sentenced to 10 years in club fed for a NFA violation.

Cleo sign offs can be tricky

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