FSA2013 Compliant Rifles

TheYetti · Apr 8, 2013

Does anyone think it would be a bad idea to compile a list of semi-auto rifles that we THINK are NOT banned by SB281?

I'd like a list but I'm not sure if its a good idea to put it out there. (I don't want them to be banned later on.)

Maybe this is the wrong section on the forum.

If it's a bad idea feel free to delete this thread.

Update: MDSP has a handy little tool to help you out.

According to this .22's are exempt

So far we have:

Beretta ARX-100
Browning BAR (the new one not the M1918 although the M1918 is probably legal too)
Ohio Ordnance Works 1918A3
M1 Garand (specifically exempt)
Ruger Mini-14 (any non-folder stock)
Ruger Mini-30 (any non-older stock)
Remington 750
SVT-40
Gewehr 41 & 43
M1 Carbine
FN-49
FN FNAR
FN SCAR
FN FS2000 (As long as it meets the OAL requirement)
MAS-49
Hakim rifle
Rasheed rifle
LG-42
AR-10
Keltec RFB Sporter (normally 26.1" but the carbine config, but with 24 inch barrel, brings that up to 32")
Keltec SU-16
Keltec SUB2000
Polytech M14 (WTF?) See here
Tavor (with barrel extension for OAL - Saw one at OnTarget)
Vz 58 (Rifle LOOKS like an AK but shares no parts with the Kalashnikov guns)
Vz 2000
Vz 2008
Benelli R1
NEMO OMEN

Gas Piston ARs
H&K MR556A1

"HBAR" AR-15's
LWRCI M6

Possible Rifles:
~~M14 (Bill doesn't list M14 but does list M1a and M21 - many states with AWB's exempt the M1a but specifically ban the M14. A little ass backwards thur son)~~

Para Ordnance TTR (Looks like an AR but lacks the buffer tube. Lower receiver could be considered an AR15 but could be modified)

Ruger SR556 (proprietary gas piston)

Robinson XCR

Aries Defense SCR

Beretta MR1 (Did those even go on sale?)

H&K SL8-6 (lol remember these?)

SIG 556

An interesting idea:
If the M1 Garand is exempt I'd say an M1 Garand with a detachable 10 shot BAR mag COULD be considered legal. I remember some time ago hearing about an M1 Garand that was built and being sent to China during WW2 that had a 10 shot magazine (can't remember if it was detachable or not). They made and shipped numerous rifles and included the tooling to make more of those guns but I think the boat sank en route and only a single example exists in a museum.

dlmcbm · Apr 8, 2013

Pistol grip is not a feature. Only folding stock, grenade / flare launcher and Flash suppressor.

ELEMENT94 · Apr 8, 2013

M14 is a machine gun and is covered by a billion other laws. Def not GTG.

TheYetti · Apr 8, 2013

dlmcbm said:
Pistol grip is not a feature. Only folding stock, grenade / flare launcher and Flash suppressor.

Thanks. Edited to remove pistol grip statements.

ELEMENT94 said:
M14 is a machine gun and is covered by a billion other laws. Def not GTG.

Does that include Nation Match rifles?

Markp · Apr 8, 2013

TheYetti said:
Does anyone think it would be a bad idea to compile a list of semi-auto rifles that we think are NOT banned by SB281?

An interesting idea:
If the M1 Garand is exempt I'd say an M1 Garand with a detachable 10 shot BAR mag COULD be considered legal. I remember some time ago hearing about an M1 Garand that was built and being sent to China during WW2 that had a 10 shot magazine (can't remember if it was detachable or not). They made and shipped numerous rifles and included the tooling to make more of those guns but I think the boat sank en route and only a single example exists in a museum.

Pretty much makes it similar to the banned BM-59, but not quite.

If you want a not banned .308 battle rifle with detachable 20 round mags, look no further: Argentinian FN-49, I picked up 3 of them. No flash hider, no integral grenade launcher, and no folding stock.

pilotguy · Apr 8, 2013

I think it would just give someone a list of what to put in the next ban.

ELEMENT94 · Apr 8, 2013

TheYetti said:
Thanks. Edited to remove pistol grip statements.

Does that include Nation Match rifles?

YEP

TheYetti · Apr 8, 2013

ELEMENT94 said:
YEP

Fudge... thanks. UPDATED

NateIU10 · Apr 8, 2013

My guesses based on current MSP procedures of classifying "copies":

All HBAR AR15s that don't meet the "copycat" test
All Piston AR15s that don't meet the "copycat" test
AR57s that don't meet the "copycat" test
Saiga 12 without folding stock

There are a ton, further showing how this makes no sense at all.

MadCat0911 · Apr 8, 2013

Why are we not waiting until tomorrow to talk about this?

TheYetti · Apr 8, 2013

NateIU10 said:
My guesses based on current MSP procedures of classifying "copies":

All HBAR AR15s that don't meet the "copycat" test
All Piston AR15s that don't meet the "copycat" test
AR57s that don't meet the "copycat" test
Saiga 12 without folding stock

There are a ton, further showing how this makes no sense at all.

That is an interesting idea. I definitely made the same mistake they did. I hadn't remembered or even considered specifying direct impingement vs piston driven AR's. Maybe I will be able to get my Ruger SR-556 after all.

occbrian · Apr 8, 2013

NateIU10 said:
My guesses based on current MSP procedures of classifying "copies":

All HBAR AR15s that don't meet the "copycat" test
All Piston AR15s that don't meet the "copycat" test
AR57s that don't meet the "copycat" test
Saiga 12 without folding stock

There are a ton, further showing how this makes no sense at all.

Yup.

SCARS... KELTECS... KRISS VECTOR.. ruger sr556... any hand gun on the market... List is unending.

occbrian · Apr 8, 2013

MadCat0911 said:
Why are we not waiting until tomorrow to talk about this?

Today is sine die.

Any changes to the bill would have to go to the senate and the house, but they've already passed this one.

So.... they can't do anything about this one and they can't introduce new legislation to amend it.

We're fine.

NateIU10 · Apr 8, 2013

occbrian said:
Yup.

SCARS... KELTECS... KRISS VECTOR.. ruger sr556... any hand gun on the market... List is unending.

Exactly. I was just trying to show how "banned" list items are still legal essentially. I don't even want to get into the list of stuff they just don't regulate at all.

Moral is this: If it was cash and carry before the law, it's still cash and carry now.

occbrian · Apr 8, 2013

I wish companies like Larue, LWRC, Colt, etc, etc would offer the following:

Verifiable Purchase order for $1.

Delivery when you request it.

IE.... pay $1. Ask for rifle in 3 years. Legal because you have the PO.

TheYetti · Apr 8, 2013

I wonder though if they would consider the lower receiver the AR-15 or if they aren't going to specify.

MadCat0911 said:
Why are we not waiting until tomorrow to talk about this?

~~Why? What's going on tomorrow?~~

Nevermind, I get it.

occbrian · Apr 8, 2013

or... rifle for $1.... S$H is $1700.... we don't ship until you ask us to.

Fredneck · Apr 8, 2013

MadCat0911 said:
Why are we not waiting until tomorrow to talk about this?

Why would we want to talk about it before the OAG/MSP interprets/codifies this new law into the regulations? Considering Gansler and the top echelon of the MSP are politically motivated. Someone mentioned pressure could be applied to the AG via friendly legislators for clarification on these items. Anyone know what the anticipated timeline for such documentation might be? The ACLU is right-laws such as these are written so poorly allowing abuse through prosecutorial interpretation and inviting criminal entrapment of the average citizen.

NateIU10 · Apr 8, 2013

TheYetti said:
I wonder though if they would consider the lower receiver the AR-15 or if they aren't going to specify.

Why? What's going on tomorrow?

The lower can be built into a legal firearm (HBAR) and is not on the banned list. I don't see how they could ban stripped lowers, and I really don't see how they could ban complete rifles that are NOT copies as they define them.

erwos · Apr 8, 2013

TheYetti said:
Rifles that could be modified to be compliant:
Vz 58 (Rifle LOOKS like an AK but shares no parts with the Kalashnikov guns)
AR-10 (The AR-15 is listed but the AR10 isn't)

Neither of these are banned. The Vz58 can be found with a fixed stock, which alleviates concerns with the flash hider.

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