Slightly different transfer question, I think

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  • Abulg1972

    Ultimate Member
    "indefinite" simply means "not defined". No one here seems to know when the OP will return the gun to his parents, so that seems "not defined" to me.



    As discussed previously, ATF says a loan is ok even between residents of different states as long as both state laws are followed. If, for example, this Sig had an 11+ round magazine, then the OP could not accept the loan post Oct 2013.



    So as long as the OP realizes it's a temporarily LOAN and intends on returning it to his parents at some point, everyone can sleep soundly and not get their panties in a wad.







    I think we ALL agree this is the only way to go if the OP finds he enjoys using the pistol for his sporting purposes and wants to transfer ownership properly and permanently. Nod your head in agreement, OP :thumbsup:


    You guys can do what you want - it's your freedom and collection.

    But ... Where do you see the word "indefinite" anywhere in the statute? It's bad advice, period. Whatever definition you give it, it doesn't mean "temporary" as that word is used in the statute. That section of the GCA was intended to permit a short-term transfer so that the recipient could use the firearm for a lawful sporting purpose . . . and then give it back. I promise you it was not intended to cover a parent giving a firearm to his son and asking to get it back "whenever".

    In real life, when you don't post facts that could land you in the clink, no one cares how long you've had your dad's firearm. We're not dealing with that fact pattern here.
     

    ras_oscar

    Ultimate Member
    Apr 23, 2014
    1,667
    An allied question purely for my edification; Where is the statute that requirs only a FFL to ship a firearm? I assume from the lack of suggestions here that the OP shipping the firearm back to his parents is a no-no, and I'd appreciate the code cite. Federal or state?
     

    Abulg1972

    Ultimate Member
    An allied question purely for my edification; Where is the statute that requirs only a FFL to ship a firearm? I assume from the lack of suggestions here that the OP shipping the firearm back to his parents is a no-no, and I'd appreciate the code cite. Federal or state?

    It is Section 922(a)(1). You get there by piecing all of the parts together.

    (a) It shall be unlawful—

    (3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section, and (C) shall not apply to the transportation of any firearm acquired in any State prior to the effective date of this chapter;

    (5) for any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the transferor resides; except that this paragraph shall not apply to
    (A) the transfer, transportation, or delivery of a firearm made to carry out a bequest of a firearm to, or an acquisition by intestate succession of a firearm by, a person who is permitted to acquire or possess a firearm under the laws of the State of his residence, and
    (B) the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes;

    Paragraphs (1), (2), (3), and (4) of this subsection shall not apply to transactions between licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, and licensed collectors. Paragraph (4) of this subsection shall not apply to a sale or delivery to any research organization designated by the Attorney General.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    An allied question purely for my edification; Where is the statute that requirs only a FFL to ship a firearm? I assume from the lack of suggestions here that the OP shipping the firearm back to his parents is a no-no, and I'd appreciate the code cite. Federal or state?

    There are none.

    The only law is that you cannot ship a firearm to an unlicensed individual. And an FFL can only ship a firearm back to an unlicensed individual if the firearm was shipped to them for work or repair.

    I ship firearms all the time to places. I shipped my Rem 700 barreled action (legally a firearm) to a shop in Ohio to have the barrel threaded and a muzzle brake installed. I also shipped my Gold Cup to Wilson Combat for some customizing.

    I have shipped back at least 2 or 3 firearms to the manufacturer for repairs. Including handguns.

    In all cases, the firearms were shipped back to me.

    The shipping companies (USPS, UPS, FedEx) have rules about what you can ship and how. USPS will only take handguns from an FFL to an FFL. FedEx allows long guns to go Ground, but handguns have to over Overnight.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    It is Section 922(a)(1). You get there by piecing all of the parts together.

    (a) It shall be unlawful—

    (3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section, and (C) shall not apply to the transportation of any firearm acquired in any State prior to the effective date of this chapter;

    (5) for any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the transferor resides; except that this paragraph shall not apply to
    (A) the transfer, transportation, or delivery of a firearm made to carry out a bequest of a firearm to, or an acquisition by intestate succession of a firearm by, a person who is permitted to acquire or possess a firearm under the laws of the State of his residence, and
    (B) the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes;

    Paragraphs (1), (2), (3), and (4) of this subsection shall not apply to transactions between licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, and licensed collectors. Paragraph (4) of this subsection shall not apply to a sale or delivery to any research organization designated by the Attorney General.

    None of that prohibits the shipment of a firearm to an FFL by a non-FFL.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    I see.

    I agree, NO he cannot ship it back to his parents. One end of the shipment has to be an FFL.

    So he could ship it to an FFL for his parents to pick up, but they might be charged a transfer fee.
     

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