How many lumens for a flashlight to create a tactical advantage?

Minuteman · Jan 28, 2015

I'm a big fan of flashlights, and this question of 'how many lumens do I need for tactical' advantage is pretty common. So I'm going to pose it to you the gentle reader. Before arbitrarily answering, please consider these discussions on this subject:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?227950-How-many-lumens-is-too-much

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=473023

http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=230307

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread...y-need-for-home-defense-When-is-it-too-bright

I found this video the most informative:

This video suggests that 840 lumens from the PD35 was about the threshold to make a significant difference.

Not all lumen are measured the same. In very low light, when your eyes are accumulated to near total darkness even low lumen (30-60) can be significant in temporarily ruining someone's night vision. But in general low light, I personally feel 200 lumens about the minimal and around 1000 optimal for tactical advantage.

Now, you do your own research, or if you already have, please give your opinion.

Minuteman · Jan 28, 2015

A critical factor is how large the flashlight would have to be, and how quickly it would use up the battery.

Don't just consider maximum lumens, this is an Every Day Carry (EDC) flashlight; so it needs to be light and small enough that you would carry it every day.

For me, two CR123 batteries is about all I can imagine carrying everyday (work, play, weekends).

Back in 2008, the best technology using 2x CR123 batteries was about 200 lumen max. Today (2015), that is closer to 1000 lumen. Both using better LED's and better electronics and both using two CR123 batteries.

Just imagine what kind of lumens two CR123's will push in a year.

SRD · Jan 28, 2015

In very low light, when your eyes are accumulated to near total darkness even low lumen (30-60) can be significant in temporarily ruining someone's night vision. But in general low light, I personally feel 200 lumens about the minimal and around 1000 optimal for tactical advantage.

^^ I think this says a lot,which is why I voted 100-500.I like 300-400 as a general rule.

zoostation · Jan 28, 2015

I want as many lumens as possible. I'm not worried about my night vision as even a relatively low output light is going to ruin it anyway. Plus my experience has been that anywhere except for the woods or BFE there are so many sources of ambient lighting that halfway decent natural night vision is just wishful thinking anyway. So I want something that is going to blind and disorient the bad guy as much as possible.

hogarth · Jan 28, 2015

The AIT class I took at CSAT convinced me that more lumens is more betterer. For a little light I like the Streamlight Protac 1L. For a light that's a little bigger but packs way more punch, enough to illuminate a darkened shed from outside in the daylight, and enough flood to flash someone indoors and get an instant read on whole-body-hand-hand without moving the light around over the person, I like the Fenix PD 35 960 lumen model. It is still EDC sized but really throws out a nice beam.

Minuteman · Jan 28, 2015

Agreed with all comments I've read so far:

- when you lose YOUR natural night-vision; which will happen almost immediately, you need the extra lumen to see your surroundings and potential target(s)

- more is generally better

- you can always 'splash' light off a ceiling, the ground or a wall; you don't need to worry about having to aim directly where you are looking. This way you might be able to preserve some of your natural night-vision for when it's really critical.

- as much as I appreciate the 2000 lumen flashlight I bought during a group buy here from a member; it's just too large to carry everyday.

- This 720 lumen Stream light serves both as both a Picatinny gun light and a pocket flashlight (with laser); might be the ultimate commercially available today.

rdc · Jan 28, 2015

I want enough to

airsporter · Jan 28, 2015

Minuteman said:
For me, two CR123 batteries is about all I can imagine carrying everyday (work, play, weekends).

+1
More is better, within these guidelines

Mark75H · Jan 28, 2015

Great thread! I was wondering the same thing and about to do research to learn the answers

501st · Jan 28, 2015

From what I've read ~200 lumens is the threshold. Which shouldn't be a problems since most lights are currently well above that level.

Mike · Jan 28, 2015

Try this if you want to set the bad guy on fire with your light

LimaVictor said:
250, 300, 400, 500 lumens? PFFFFFT!!
Try 4100 lumens! Set the perp's toupee on fire with this flashlight!
http://www.wickedlasers.com/torch

Minuteman · Jan 29, 2015

501st said:
From what I've read ~200 lumens is the threshold. Which shouldn't be a problems since most lights are currently well above that level.

I remember when a 200 lumen light was a big deal, today lots of lights can do that.

No matter how bright you find a light nothing compares to a reflection of sunlight. Mirrors are fantastic signaling devices.

Minuteman · Jan 30, 2015

Here is the discussion that spawned this poll thread: http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=168732&page=3

Scottysan · Jan 30, 2015

I've still got a couple of those 100-200 lum lights. good for glove box, camping etc.

Minuteman · Jan 30, 2015

Scottysan said:
I've still got a couple of those 100-200 lum lights. good for glove box, camping etc.

Yep, there are some good and cheap flashlights these days. As a kid we just had junk, mostly C and D cells that weren't too bright or worked too well. [insert political joke here]

I now heavily lean toward the gun mountable lights. The slightly larger size and rail give you the options of using like a normal flashlight or mounting on a gun, helmet, bike, anything with a piccatiny rail.

The Shooter · Jan 30, 2015

Best EDC light IMO is the Maglite XL series. They start about $35 for a XL50- 150 lumin light that's made in America or $100 for the rechargeable tactical model Mag Tac that puts out 500 lumin.

Minuteman · Aug 26, 2015

A buddy just bought a new tactical flashlight. He wanted something he could carry, but also put it on his shotgun for when he's at home.

I guess that's one way to check on your shotgun every day. I think I'd rather have at least a couple lights, and leave one dedicated and on the shotgun.

Jaybeez · Aug 26, 2015

i think he posted his story here before, but a friend of mine was attacked/jumped whatever one night while skateboarding. he was carrying a 180-200 limen flashlight i had given him, and with the details of how he turned the tables on his attacker, that light played a huge role.

hogarth · Aug 26, 2015

The answer to how many lumens I want is: all of them.

It's not just about seeing someone. It's about identifying the person, what's in their hands, what's immediately around them, etc.

Half-cocked · Aug 26, 2015

When the power levels are measured in watts, instead of lumens....

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