SAF SUES IN MARYLAND OVER HANDGUN PERMIT DENIAL UPDATED 3-5-12

Dead Eye · Mar 12, 2012

Klunatic said:
It has? I haven't seen any filings for the Appeal, just a request to Legg to clarify his ruling and a stay during an appeal to the 4th.

Neither have I, and so I wrote back asking that very question. As to whether he will reply, I do not know. The point is, this has become the "official" MDSP position.

Dead Eye · Mar 12, 2012

Boondock Saint said:
This is correct, however the state will be appealing the case shortly.

Did Judge Legg sign off, or is the State bypassing?

Boondock Saint · Mar 12, 2012

Dead Eye said:
Did Judge Legg sign off, or is the State bypassing?

Legg doesn't need to sign off on an appeal. That goes directly to CA4. The staying motion goes before Legg, and if he rejects it, the state can take it to CA4. If CA4 rejects the motion, Legg's ruling is the law of the land unless a higher court (CA4 or SCOTUS) says otherwise.

Dead Eye · Mar 12, 2012

Boondock Saint said:
Legg doesn't need to sign off on an appeal. That goes directly to CA4. The staying motion goes before Legg, and if he rejects it, the state can take it to CA4. If CA4 rejects the motion, Legg's ruling is the law of the land unless a higher court (CA4 or SCOTUS) says otherwise.

So now we wait until CA4 either accepts or denies?

Boondock Saint · Mar 12, 2012

Dead Eye said:
So now we wait until CA4 either accepts or denies?

The state has not appealed as of yet. Their motions for a stay and for clarification are presently before Judge Legg. Plaintiffs (our side) have until this Friday to file their response to the state's motions. Legg will rule on both of the state's motions at some point after receiving the plaintiff's response.

JMangle · Mar 12, 2012

Storm40 said:
you say that like it's a bad thing?

Isn't your avatar a polymer framed pistol?

(I know, I know, not relevant to the thread, I'm sorry)

Dead Eye · Mar 12, 2012

Boondock Saint said:
The state has not appealed as of yet. Their motions for a stay and for clarification are presently before Judge Legg. Plaintiffs (our side) have until this Friday to file their response to the state's motions. Legg will rule on both of the state's motions at some point after receiving the plaintiff's response.

So, the MDSP is just wringing their hands, until what they understand will ultimately be the State's appeal?

Dead Eye · Mar 12, 2012

JMangle said:
Isn't your avatar a polymer framed pistol?

(I know, I know, not relevant to the thread, I'm sorry)

Then PM them, or something...

Mike OTDP · Mar 12, 2012

Dead Eye said:
So, the MDSP is just wringing their hands, until what they understand will ultimately be the State's appeal?

Yup. To be fair, they're bound to obey their political masters, who haven't quite realized that they are in the position of the segregationists of the early 1960s.

krucam · Mar 12, 2012

Mike OTDP said:
Yup. To be fair, they're bound to obey their political masters, who haven't quite realized that they are in the position of the segregationists of the early 1960s.

Great comparison. We'll have SAF's response to the stay request this Friday, hopefully a decision on the stay request from Judge Legg as early as the next week or two...

Mike OTDP · Mar 12, 2012

Threeband said:
Which is just what I would expect. They'll bury their heads in the sand as long as they can.

But no matter what, we'll never go back to March 4, the day before the Legg decision. The debate has changed forever.

And the more applications they try to sit on, the more it strengthens our cause.

This will be interesting to watch. I figure that as of about now, the whole notion that they were issuing permits to anyone who bothered to apply has been completely vaporized.

Not to mention that when we ultimately win this, it sets up a train wreck about delays. The state will have a massive backlog of applications, no way to process them...and a failure to do so promptly will result not only in a class action lawsuit with significant financial penalties, but potential criminal charges. The only reasonable way out would be an immediate recognition of all non-resident permits held by MD residents.

Dead Eye · Mar 12, 2012

Mike OTDP said:
This will be interesting to watch. I figure that as of about now, the whole notion that they were issuing permits to anyone who bothered to apply has been completely vaporized.

Not to mention that when we ultimately win this, it sets up a train wreck about delays. The state will have a massive backlog of applications, no way to process them...and a failure to do so promptly will result not only in a class action lawsuit with significant financial penalties, but potential criminal charges. The only reasonable way out would be an immediate recognition of all non-resident permits held by MD residents.

My previous reply was rather rhetorical, in that the MDSP, via LT Beason, is therefore stating that they are not actively processing applications because the State has appealed, when indeed they have not...

"What did they know and when did they know it?"

swinokur · Mar 12, 2012

Is an actual injunction possible?

Threeband · Mar 12, 2012

Mike OTDP said:
Yup. To be fair, they're bound to obey their political masters, who haven't quite realized that they are in the position of the segregationists of the early 1960s.

When I looked over the permit application form, I was reminded of the old segregationist literacy tests, poll taxes, and other chicanery intended to keep blacks from voting.

Another poster had the same thought, and found this Alabama Voter's Registration form.

http://www.mdshooters.com/showpost.php?p=1546329&postcount=63

Check this thing out and compare it to Maryland's application:

http://www.crmvet.org/info/litapp.pdf

I wonder if the Maryland permit application is based on Maryland's old Jim Crow Voter forms? That would be a bombshell!

.

menacek04 · Mar 12, 2012

OnTarget said:
I'd like to hear from any out-of-staters that are applying for the MD CCW.

I have been watching this and would love to join in support by sending my own application. I live in DE, but work in MD. I am a current ccdw permit holder in DE and would greatly appreciate the ability to travel to and from my place of work without having to leave my gun at home.

Question: Do the same application rules apply for an non-resident as they do for resident? I was not sure if MD even offered non-resident ccdw permits.

swinokur · Mar 12, 2012

MD makes no distinction on resident or non resident permits. Anyone can apply. The app is the same.

BenL · Mar 12, 2012

Mike OTDP said:
Yup. To be fair, they're bound to obey their political masters, who haven't quite realized that they are in the position of the segregationists of the early 1960s.

What's the likelihood of Maryland scrapping their whole CCW scheme and streamlining the process to be more in line with other states?

mrjam2jab · Mar 12, 2012

menacek04 said:
I have been watching this and would love to join in support by sending my own application. I live in DE, but work in MD. I am a current ccdw permit holder in DE and would greatly appreciate the ability to travel to and from my place of work without having to leave my gun at home.

Question: Do the same application rules apply for an non-resident as they do for resident? I was not sure if MD even offered non-resident ccdw permits.

I have every intention of applying.....IF i can convince the Mrs. to allow me. :rolleyes:

Threeband · Mar 12, 2012

mrjam2jab said:
I have every intention of applying.....IF i can convince the Mrs. to allow me.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Get her to apply, too.
.

Glaug-Eldare · Mar 12, 2012

BenL said:
What's the likelihood of Maryland scrapping their whole CCW scheme and streamlining the process to be more in line with other states?

What concerns me is that there are certain to be forces in the GA and administration who would prefer to eliminate permits altogether, and go to the Illinois system. The cost of a handgun permit will immediately harmonize with the cost of being bribing the county exec to make you a "conservator of the peace"

SAF SUES IN MARYLAND OVER HANDGUN PERMIT DENIAL UPDATED 3-5-12

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