classic firearms mystery gun?

Abulg1972 · Apr 24, 2015

Alls I know is, Brutus says these are Nagants and they don't look like Nagants.

FWIW, the people that Classic POed are the collectors who have been in the game for a while. The new guys just coming into the hobby and hearing about "Moisons" are happy to pay $240 for one.

yellowsled · Apr 24, 2015

Abulg1972 said:
Alls I know is, Brutus says these are Nagants and they don't look like Nagants.

FWIW, the people that Classic POed are the collectors who have been in the game for a while. The new guys just coming into the hobby and hearing about "Moisons" are happy to pay $240 for one.

No offence, but it seems like you seem to be the only one upset about these prices on this forum. I have been collecting for a number of years also, and I am not bothered the least bit by his prices. :thumbsup:

Abulg1972 · Apr 24, 2015

yellowsled said:
No offence, but it seems like you seem to be the only one upset about these prices on this forum. I have been collecting for a number of years also, and I am not bothered the least bit by his prices.

No offense taken. . I'm not upset with them at all. Thinking that a business practice is a bit shady and being upset with them aren't necessarily the same thing. They can do whatever they want in their business as long as it's legal. But, you might want to check out the Mosin-Nagant forum on gunboards, which has an audience that's a tiny bit bigger than Maryland shooters. There's a 4+ page thread on this issue.

It seems like you are having a hard time accepting that I'm entitled to disagree with their practices and choose, based on that disagreement, whether to do business with them in the future. You are not alone in your view of what they did, and there are plenty of people who feel it was perfectly fine. I, on the other hand, tend to shy away from retailers who take advantage of consumers over a few bucks.

yellowsled · Apr 24, 2015

gotcha.. All good!

C&RTactical · Apr 24, 2015

I am kind of surprised the price has jumped this much in the past 3 years. It was getting past the $100 mark when I got into the 91/30 market. As much as I am sad to see the Era of $100 Mosins pass it definitely was not going to last after I got in. Out the door most Mosins I could find seem to be $150 when I got in three years ago. Also ammo has gotten slightly more expensive it is still far cheaper than our other options in the C&R market. Ammo is only $.25 a shot I last checked for surplus. And the guns are barely breaking $200. So given the demand I think the rise is price is actually kind of low. My current favorites are the K31, which start at $300 with $.50 ammo, although cheap for what it is, in my opinion, still not as economical to get into. Though I would recommend more people get into the Swiss rifles over the Mosin for the huge step in quality for not much higher price.

j_h_smith · Apr 24, 2015

I think the price increase of almost all C&R firearms is because of the popularity of the C&R license. When I got my license, I was buying the Nagant revolver for $69. Now look at them. But now that everyone has jumped onto the C&R bandwagon, all C&R firearms are getting expensive.

The market has opened up, the wholesalers/retailers know they can sell just about any type of C&R firearm and they also know that many, many people will pay for these firearms.

It's kinda like the dealers charging 20% above the MSRP for a popular car. They know people will pay the price, so they keep raising the price until people stop buying. But I don't think they have hit that plateau yet.

Abulg1972 · Apr 24, 2015

C&RTactical said:
I am kind of surprised the price has jumped this much in the past 3 years. It was getting past the $100 mark when I got into the 91/30 market. As much as I am sad to see the Era of $100 Mosins pass it definitely was not going to last after I got in. Out the door most Mosins I could find seem to be $150 when I got in three years ago. Also ammo has gotten slightly more expensive it is still far cheaper than our other options in the C&R market. Ammo is only $.25 a shot I last checked for surplus. And the guns are barely breaking $200. So given the demand I think the rise is price is actually kind of low. My current favorites are the K31, which start at $300 with $.50 ammo, although cheap for what it is, in my opinion, still not as economical to get into. Though I would recommend more people get into the Swiss rifles over the Mosin for the huge step in quality for not much higher price.

I'm with you but I think part of it is the amazing attention that Mosin-Nagants have gotten in the last few years. When I got my 03 FFL in 2013, you could buy a refurb 91/30 with for $99 - $119. Part of it is that you can get a 70+ year old battle rifle for less than $250. Part of it is politics. The Demtards' gun control efforts have, in some ways, backfired because they have pushed everyone and their mothers to become interested in guns and/or buy more guns.

I don't own a 91/30 and I probably will never buy one unless I find a Finn or something else unusual in unrefurbed shape.

Melnic · Apr 24, 2015

During the post Newtown scare 2 years ago, the Mosins disappeared. They were selling out of crates for $170-$180 and disappearing fast at that price.
Then I think that fall, the Grade B $89 black friday sale hit and its like everyone thinks THAT is still the going price because 3 year old videos on youtube mention "less than $100 for a Mosin".
I think "take advantage of" is a bit harsh. If someone does not want to buy one, don't!
Samco had K31 rifles @ $379 about 2 years ago. Then a flood appeared and the prices went down.

Now, what is not making sense to me is the Dollar to Ruble and dollar to Ukrainian Hryvnia exchange rate. US dollar buying power has pretty much doubled in the last year. Russian imports should be cheaper but we are not seeing it. Maybe we are not seeing it because Russian Imports are just harder to get.

Abulg1972 · Apr 24, 2015

When I say "taking advantage of", I don't mean that Classic is taking money from widows and orphans for necessities. I realize that these are collectibles, not necessities. My point is that Classic is a large business with a long history of selling firearms. Pricing at such companies is thought out weeks or months in advance. They know what they have to pay for something, and they know how to figure out what their markup should be. When I said "taking advantage of", I was talking about the "hey, these things are selling like hot cakes! Let's up the price." I don't know . . . that just left a bad taste in my mouth. Pick a price for this offering and stick with it. Don't jack the price up just because you can. That's all.

Machodoc · Apr 25, 2015

yellowsled said:
I have been collecting for a number of years also, and I am not bothered the least bit by his prices.

Hah! Because you probably have storage locker somewhere that's stacked to the ceiling with crates of them. I know you! :innocent0

Machodoc · Apr 25, 2015

Abulg1972 said:
When I said "taking advantage of", I was talking about the "hey, these things are selling like hot cakes! Let's up the price." I don't know . . . that just left a bad taste in my mouth. Pick a price for this offering and stick with it. Don't jack the price up just because you can. That's all.

This is the heart of the matter, right here. ^^ How individuals react to it, however, is going to vary a great deal. Why? Dunno ... someone could get a doctoral dissertation out of that research, I guess. Income? Background? What their daddy believed in? Who knows?

I personally lean toward the side of it making the dealer sound like he'd wring any penny that he can out of the customer, and it doesn't show any respect for his customer base of regular collectors. There's also that sorta-kinda flavor of he made a (not really) "contract" with his customers by hyping the guns for days, then rolling them out at one price, then bumping up the prices a couple of times before they had a chance to order.

Not illegal, but I find it slightly distasteful. YMMV

On the other hand, I can see how others here would high-five him, if they saw him in person, for having the business savvy to act quickly enough to capitalize on the sudden demand for an unexpectedly-curtailed commodity. That's how they look at the situation, and that's what they are entitled to do.

What we all can agree on, however, is that you buy if you are willing to pay the price, and you don't buy if you aren't. And I think that Classic also knows that any distasteful memories they might leave behind by this would probably be forgotten if they offered something else, something really nice, at a bargain price.

For me, though, it takes away a little trust. I'll be watching them closer in the future for "hype" vs. simple straight-dealing. Stuff like this tends to make me wonder, for example, if their "hand select" process is really what we hope it will be, or if that's also just hype that allows them to tack on some extra bucks for the next gun off the pile ... and they chuckle at their customers for being so gullible as to do that, because the free market permits it.

JamesH · Apr 26, 2015

Allan's Armory just posted a few new Mosin Nagant rifles for sale. They're more than the ones from Classic, but buying from Allan's, you're buying a specific rifle with pics. Prices from $225-$240.

http://www.allans-armory.com/aaresult.php?PageId=35

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