A warning on carrying spring-assisted knives.

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  • Norton

    NRA Endowment Member, Rifleman
    Staff member
    Admin
    Moderator
    May 22, 2005
    122,856
    PM CharlieFoxtrot. He's out in Frederick or thereabouts.

    If he can't do it, he can refer you.
     

    boardboy330

    Resident Secret Squirrel
    Mar 18, 2008
    12,630
    Get a good attorney...as was said in the water cooler...talk to CF...if he can't help you he can put you in touch with a good attorney.

    That said, a good atty would argue first the "search and seizure" was unconstitutional. Secondly of course they would argue you are within your rights to carry a knife within the limits of the law. I am assuming you weren't breaking any laws.

    Good luck...hope it works out for you.
     

    BenL

    John Galt Speaking.
    Too little info for an educated opinion, although I do suspect the "unrelated matter" ended in the knife going by-by.

    When this all shakes out, I, too, would like to here what happened, since I also carry a spring assisted knife; a knife that can be purchased at any Walmart.
     

    haoleboy

    1/2 Banned
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 17, 2005
    4,085
    Dentsville
    Yeah streetgang I do it for safety and in fact I have line , "sir remind me to give you your knife back at the conclusion of out encounter as I don't like taking another mans things" and as name taken mentioned please read Terry v Ohio actually while ur at it read Pennsylvania vs Mims. The supreme court has recognized the danger of the job and alloted US certain tools so we have a better chance at going home. I guess its beating a dead horse at this point due to lack of knowledge of the unrelated incident but did anyone look up their local ordinances?

    I'm not condoneing any actions taken by anyone I'd obviously like to know more but as mentioned I believe its a time place circumstances arrest
    For safety huh? So if I'm legally walking around the National Mall and you walk past me and you see me with a knife clipped inside my pocket....That is cause to stop me and take my knife "for your safety?"
    How about I ask to hold your gun for MY safety since cop or not, I have no reason what so ever to trust you?

    On a side note, I'd love to hear the WHOLE story from buzzzy.
     

    clandestine

    AR-15 Savant
    Oct 13, 2008
    37,031
    Elkton, MD
    For safety huh? So if I'm legally walking around the National Mall and you walk past me and you see me with a knife clipped inside my pocket....That is cause to stop me and take my knife "for your safety?"
    How about I ask to hold your gun for MY safety since cop or not, I have no reason what so ever to trust you?

    On a side note, I'd love to hear the WHOLE story from buzzzy.

    I would like to see you try and take a cops gun. LOVE TO.
     

    joppaj

    Sheepdog
    Staff member
    Moderator
    Apr 11, 2008
    46,459
    MD
    For safety huh? So if I'm legally walking around the National Mall and you walk past me and you see me with a knife clipped inside my pocket....That is cause to stop me and take my knife "for your safety?"

    No. It is a very different story though when the subject is already legally stopped.
     

    Biggie313

    Molon Labe
    Feb 23, 2010
    1,223
    Essex
    Sucky story, and as far as I read it, you broke no law with the knife. I refuse to give up my rights even if police perform illegal arrests and seizures. What are you supposed to do if they arrest you do carrying another legal object, a screwdriver for instance. You could be perfectly legal, but you get arrested, put in jail, and have to go through a month long process and lose thousands of dollars.
     

    Lex Armarum

    Ultimate Member
    Oct 19, 2009
    3,450
    Hahahaha, you guys are great! I love reading these threads. I actually AGREE with the cops in this thread. The police, upon a stop, have the right to do a cursory frisk of your person for their protection (I lost a case on this as a prosecutor once because the cop did a more than cursory search). Not my personal opinion FWIW, but it is the law.

    The interesting thing about this case - from the known facts - is that either there was a search or there wasn't. The police officer/SA could argue plain view but that would then negate the concealment element of the charge. Moreover the officer - from what is known - did not seemingly frisk the Def but rather saw the knife and grabbed it further negating the concealment element. On the other hand, officers/SA could argue legit search and RAS from feel (if frisk occurred) but then run afoul of the "pen knife" jurisprudence.

    Good times. You guys are great.
     

    haoleboy

    1/2 Banned
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 17, 2005
    4,085
    Dentsville
    I always take knives away from people all the time. I mean I give them the knives back at the conclusion of my investigaton but thats if they aren't coming with me and no crime has been committed.

    Did you check the local hagerstown laws there might be one in there about the weapon due to the way it was carried, size, or myabe it was the assisted opening.

    I do agree however that sucks, I always have a knife......hahaha then again a lot of the times I have a gun.

    Usually for that charge to stick there has to be some sort of time/place/circumstances surrounding the reason for carrying the knife. I understand not wanting to tell us the "unrelated matter" but I am assuming the "unrelated matter" could have lead up to the CDW charge. But then again just a guess from what I read since I wasn't there.

    Hope everything works out for the better!

    No. It is a very different story though when the subject is already legally stopped.
    I understand the legally stopped part. But from what I bolded in MPDC post, it seems that he is taking weapons no matter the situation of the encounter.
    ie: If I stopped him and asked for a # for the nearest Tow company as my car just died. He may see my knife clipped inside my pocket and take it from me while he looked for the #. doesn't seem right.
     

    haoleboy

    1/2 Banned
    MDS Supporter
    Sep 17, 2005
    4,085
    Dentsville
    I would like to see you try and take a cops gun. LOVE TO.
    I didn't say take. I said ask to hold. Understand what I said for what I wrote. Please don't turn it around to suit your petty argument.
    Yet again you jump in a thread and add absolutely nothing. Its no wonder so many members have you on their ignore list. :rolleyes:
     

    11b10

    Member
    Jun 15, 2010
    99
    Union Bridge, MD
    )I was questioned by some cops for a matter unrelated to the knife)

    and it went like this...

    I was hanging out with bo-bo and peanut the local drug dealers, when the cops rolled in, they ran jumped a fence, got away... I could'nt jump the fence so they started asking me simple questions like do you know who those guys are?, why are you with them? so I told the cops we were arranging a bake sale for my sick mom, because bo-bo and peanut are very community foucused---- then it went down hill.

    So what did they want to talk to you about??
     

    jaypark

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Sep 29, 2009
    3,471
    peoples republic of MOCO
    I was hanging out with bo-bo and peanut the local drug dealers, when the cops rolled in, they ran jumped a fence, got away... I could'nt jump the fence so they started asking me simple questions like do you know who those guys are?, why are you with them? so I told the cops we were arranging a bake sale for my sick mom, because bo-bo and peanut are very community foucused---- then it went down hill.

    usually its like dis

    'ya know I be like snooging it out like dat and i dos dirt but not like that kinda sick dirt.... kno what im saying'
     

    BlackBart

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Mar 20, 2007
    31,609
    Conewago, York Co. Pa.
    For safety huh? So if I'm legally walking around the National Mall and you walk past me and you see me with a knife clipped inside my pocket....That is cause to stop me and take my knife "for your safety?"
    How about I ask to hold your gun for MY safety since cop or not, I have no reason what so ever to trust you?

    On a side note, I'd love to hear the WHOLE story from buzzzy.

    Ding ding ding! Was something stupid said that brought this on? I usually don't have much interaction with cops on duty unless I know them. Live and let live. :)
     

    Jack Gordon

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Aug 27, 2011
    689
    Places Unknown
    I understand the legally stopped part. But from what I bolded in MPDC post, it seems that he is taking weapons no matter the situation of the encounter.
    ie: If I stopped him and asked for a # for the nearest Tow company as my car just died. He may see my knife clipped inside my pocket and take it from me while he looked for the #. doesn't seem right.

    You like to push buttons, I can tell by how you type. Your also the type that will one day push the wrong persons buttons and be in a shitstorm of hurt. If you wanna be a lawyer go pass the bar, nobodys stopping you. As for mpdc's post, I side with him. I've read a lot of his posts on here and he seems very fair. If he wants to hold someone's knife until something is sorted out I say go ahead. I believe the more comfortable you can make an Leo the better the outcome for you so why not?
     

    Name Taken

    Ultimate Member
    Feb 23, 2010
    11,891
    Central
    For safety huh? So if I'm legally walking around the National Mall and you walk past me and you see me with a knife clipped inside my pocket

    If the police have a reason to stop you or just want to chat because of the area you are in, the company you are keeping, your actions obersved by them, and other visual clues then yes they can remove a weapon from you. Doesnt matter if the weapon is illegal or not.

    Heck if they encounter you and you seem hostile they can legally take the weapon until the stop is over.



    To all those complainaning about our legal system and having to defend yourself can you point to a better system? In many countries you'll just have to pay the cop to ignore the crime. Or the police are their as an image only (i.e. India) and when rounds start flying they start running away.

    Our legal system is arguable one of the best in the world. Give me a good alternative before you start complaining how awful it is that the police can arrest, remove property, and aren't found quilty simple because of the arrest.
     

    Name Taken

    Ultimate Member
    Feb 23, 2010
    11,891
    Central
    The interesting thing about this case - from the known facts - is that either there was a search or there wasn't. The police officer/SA could argue plain view but that would then negate the concealment element of the charge.


    Of course I'm guessing here because the entire facts of this incident havent been posted.

    But you can "conceal" a weapon from the police/public and have it come into plain view.

    So defendant has gun in his waistband concealed from view. In his course of reaching for ID or anything else the officer observes it. Then wouldnt that be a "concealed" plain view case?
     

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