Rifle scope level

echo6mike said:

Depends on how old ya are

Sent from my mobile excuse the types pleasde!

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E.Shell said:

I'm subject to the same error and ALL of my serious rifles have a level. I keep a couple extra in my tool box to loan out for classes in case the student doesn't have one of his own.

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Bolts Rock said:

Too bad levels aren't incorporated into the scope's field of view.

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engineerbrian said:

Ed, can you post a link to a level that you recomend?

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E.Shell said:

None have resolution any better than a carpenter's level, all are better than nothing.

I like the US Optics fixed version like this and it really doesn't stick out past the parallax adjustment on the bigger tactical/target scopes: http://www.usoptics.com/uso-gear/accessories/ext-cant-indicator/rail-mounted-fixed-acd.html

Some folks with more compact scopes prefer the folding model: http://www.usoptics.com/uso-gear/accessories/ext-cant-indicator/rail-mounted-swivel-acd.html

The AccuLevel is a good one too, it can be used folded or extended:http://www.brownells.com/optics-mou...level-articulating-scope-level-prod42396.aspx

The Vortex is a decent level as well:http://www.brownells.com/optics-mou...nti-cant-devices/bubble-levels-prod58649.aspx

Don't get too caught up in how much better one is than the other, it's more about styling than accuracy. No matter how well crafted any of these seem, they're all using bubble elements that are about the same resolution as a carpenter's level and NONE approach the precision of a machinist's level. They all work well enough for shooting.

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echo6mike said:

When I was a 20-something Marine, I could get 9 or 10 out of 10 in the black at 500m every year with the M16 and iron sights. When my Dad was in Army basic in '51, they had to shoot 1000 yard with M1s and iron sights.

I've got my Garand now, so this year I intend to get out someplace with longer-range firing lines and see how far I can reach out and touch something. Can I still do 500 yards? Can I hit farther out? I really want to find out!

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E.Shell said:

I'd suggest that for precision work, you should have a level for anything beyond about 100 yards. For generously sized targets, such as game animals, you can usually go to 200-300 before error becomes apparent.

The actual error induced is a product of the sight height, angle from true vertical and distance/drop. Distance and drop are inseparable, as they represent the same component in this function.

Flatter shooting stuff has a greater degree of forgiveness than do cartridges with a lot of drop. The greater the drop, the larger an arc we prescribe over whatever angle we lean. Sight height has the same effect of increasing the radius of the error and thus the arc length.

Iron sights are usually so close to the bore, they're much easier to manage in terms of rifle cant - the error is both of less magnitude and is also less likely to occur with the wide open view than when peering through a small tubular opening.

We, as human organisms, position ourselves relative to the outside world using several senses for references and corrections. Normally, our inner ear (Vestibular system) provides us a level reference, and we then use our eyes (interpupilary relationship) to judge "level" from there.

When we lean our heads over the stock to properly mount the cheek piece, we defeat our inner ear's ability to keep our head straight, but our eyes still want to be our reference tool and now your brain thinks the whole world should roll over with your presumably level head. Having only one eye open and looking through a small field of view exacerbates this problem.

A right handed shooter will usually lean right, while a left handed shooter will lean left. In the absence of reference points (vertical target frames, etc.) most people develop a LOT more error than they believe possible. At 1k and beyond, I've seen bullets go 4-5 feet over and down simply from leaning the rifle.

I'm subject to the same error and ALL of my serious rifles have a level. I keep a couple extra in my tool box to loan out for classes in case the student doesn't have one of his own.

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E.Shell said:

I'd suggest that for precision work, you should have a level for anything beyond about 100 yards. For generously sized targets, such as game animals, you can usually go to 200-300 before error becomes apparent.

The actual error induced is a product of the sight height, angle from true vertical and distance/drop. Distance and drop are inseparable, as they represent the same component in this function.

Flatter shooting stuff has a greater degree of forgiveness than do cartridges with a lot of drop. The greater the drop, the larger an arc we prescribe over whatever angle we lean. Sight height has the same effect of increasing the radius of the error and thus the arc length.

Iron sights are usually so close to the bore, they're much easier to manage in terms of rifle cant - the error is both of less magnitude and is also less likely to occur with the wide open view than when peering through a small tubular opening.

We, as human organisms, position ourselves relative to the outside world using several senses for references and corrections. Normally, our inner ear (Vestibular system) provides us a level reference, and we then use our eyes (interpupilary relationship) to judge "level" from there.

When we lean our heads over the stock to properly mount the cheek piece, we defeat our inner ear's ability to keep our head straight, but our eyes still want to be our reference tool and now your brain thinks the whole world should roll over with your presumably level head. Having only one eye open and looking through a small field of view exacerbates this problem.

A right handed shooter will usually lean right, while a left handed shooter will lean left. In the absence of reference points (vertical target frames, etc.) most people develop a LOT more error than they believe possible. At 1k and beyond, I've seen bullets go 4-5 feet over and down simply from leaning the rifle.

I'm subject to the same error and ALL of my serious rifles have a level. I keep a couple extra in my tool box to loan out for classes in case the student doesn't have one of his own.

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E.Shell said:

A few scopes have them inside the tube at the bottom of the field of view, US Optics is one, can't recall which others had it, but I've seen several out here.

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coopermania said:

If i remember correctly gen 2&3 Springfield Armory's scopes.. I have two from Night Force that mount on the picatinny..
If you go back in history 140 years levels were available as a option on front globe sights for target and long range shooting...

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coopermania said:

QUOTE=Bolts Rock;3637347]Most of the dedicated target globe front sights still have levels.

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Bolts Rock said:

Yes/ No..... I shoot bpcr silhouette and long range using sights from MVA..... Its still a option with most sight manufacturers.

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jjbduke2004 said:

My 30mm Right Sight has a level built in. My Anschutz 18mm globes do not, however there are several add on levels that press on or thread in.

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coopermania said:

I bought my son a new Annie last year and I was surprised that Annie did not offer a bubble aperture for the front globe.

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