Banana vs straight magazine question

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  • Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    I believe this was also due to McNamara's Office of the Secretary of Defense "whiz kids" getting into a bureaucratic tussle with the Army's Bureau of Ordance during the development/introduction of the M16. The Army had been resisting the M16 in every way possible, including changing the requirement from a 300yd range to a 500 yd kill capability. Since the cartridge case had already been chosen, and the rifle designed around it, to meet the shorter range, Armalite tried a different powder to get the additional range. This powder burned in the way mentioned above.

    As I understand it, instead of the powder spec'd for the round/rifle, they decided to use the same powder at the 7.62 round. And that powder produced more calcium carbonate residue.

    They later switched to the proper powder.

    From what I remember, WW748 is very similar to the 7.62 powder, and H335 is the same as the 5.56 powder.

    The bulk grade of surplus power is WC846 and WC844 for the two ronds, but I don't remember which is which.
     

    JoeRinMD

    Rifleman
    Jul 18, 2008
    2,014
    AA County
    As I understand it, instead of the powder spec'd for the round/rifle, they decided to use the same powder at the 7.62 round. And that powder produced more calcium carbonate residue.

    That could be as well. I was basing my postings on the book "The Black Rifle", by Ezell and Stevens which is an amazing read about the history of how the M16 came to be the standard rifle of the armed forces. The Bureau of Ordnance tried every bureaucratic trick in the book to make the M16 fail. The M14 had only been recently adopted as the standard rifle, and they were trying to make sure that this new upstart wouldn't displace the rifle they created. My favorite ploy was when they gave Stoner and Armalite less than a week's notice before holding cold weather trials at Elmendorf AFB in Alaska! If you haven't read it yet, find a copy.

    JoeR
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    I know about it.

    I also know the story behind the M14, where each time it did not win, they canceled the competition, let them modify the rifle, then hold the competition again.

    We should have just bought the FAL.
     

    JoeRinMD

    Rifleman
    Jul 18, 2008
    2,014
    AA County
    I know about it.

    I also know the story behind the M14, where each time it did not win, they canceled the competition, let them modify the rifle, then hold the competition again.

    We should have just bought the FAL.

    Yes, there was some sort of back-room agreement that regarding the 7.62 round and the FAL/M14. The US would adopt the FAL if NATO would use our 7.62 round, since it was just a shortened 30-06. Then after that agreement was reached the Army said "Naaaaa...no thanks" and found reasons to go with the M14 instead!

    JoeR
     

    Sharp

    Active Member
    Feb 21, 2015
    329
    Calvert
    it is enough to make a difference, and frankly one of the big reasons was so we didn't need curvy ass magazines ungainly as all hell hanging off our gear and the necessity of machining a mag well to accomodate such a monstrosity

    The 5.56/.223 does still need a curvy magazine to feed reliably with a capacity above 20 rounds. The deep magazine well also made the curve difficult to implement. 30 round magazines were very slow to be introduced because it took a while to get the curve just right. I believe a lot of modern polymer magazines solve this by have a near constant curve inside the magazine while externally conforming to the mag well.
     

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