Martial arts or firearms training?

[Markp]

Originally Posted by Dogabutila

I highly recommend judo...

Judo is far better for throwing them, and leaving them incapable of getting up to fight again, and you don't get into any potential legal trouble.

I've taken a bunch of martial arts, and all of them have some great techniques to integrate, BUT, judo (or even ju-jitsu) provide a great set of foundation skills that are invaluable in a street fight.

As noted above, I won't trade blows with the other guy... I already know that's not my strength and I'm going to get hit... So personally, I'm closing with people grapple or opening up a distance to use a weapon.

I'll take that first hit that I know I'm gonna get in order to get a choke in or throw an opponent... Winning is not about not getting hit, it's about preventing the other guy from getting up.

[parbreak]

Minuteman,

I was at Krav Maga Columbia for over a year. Really enjoyed it, but I think I got more physical conditioning from it than "fighting skills". I already was trained in most of what was covered from private training I have taken over the years. However, what they taught seemed to blend well with what I already do.

[Minuteman]

Originally Posted by parbreak

Minuteman,

I was at Krav Maga Columbia for over a year. Really enjoyed it, but I think I got more physical conditioning from it than "fighting skills". I already was trained in most of what was covered from private training I have taken over the years. However, what they taught seemed to blend well with what I already do.

Thanks, I received a PM recommendation to a course that I found you had written a VERY positive review of. I'm already a member of a gym at work, and have opportunities to do some more local training. Undecided at the moment.

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by Minuteman

If you don't mind: what classes (heavy bag, fitness, Krav only...) did you sign up for? How many months and how much did they want? PM me if you prefer. I'd appreciate knowing as they make it tough to find out. I think because the fees vary by gym and how busy they are (popular). Like joining any gym, can vary a bit.

I signed up for Krav only. Fees were as follows (I stopped in for tour first):

6 month plan - $199 enrollment fee ($99 if sign up same day as visit) - $129 per month - $129/month month-to-month afterwards

12 month plan - $149 ($75 that day) - $109 per month - $109 month to month

24 month plan - $99 ($50) - $89 per month - $89 month to month

To add Krav fitness (any of the fit classes) is extra $20 per month

I will probably upgrade to 24 month plan before my six months are out since so far I enjoy the classes and think I will stick it out for at least 2 years.

So kind of expensive since I'm used to my life membership fee at Bally's, which is only $10 maintenance fee per month, but maybe not out of line with some of the nicer gyms. I don't know to be honest, but I think it's slightly expensive. Still, since I don't expect CCW to be legal anytime soon (no disrespect to MSI), it's my only alternative, plus I like to have a box of tools to go to so I don't always have to, god forbid, go nuclear (grab a gun) in every confrontation.

[redrumtc]

For my job we do Masada tactical look it up on YouTube
If interested in I will give u BK info mma ,knife ,guns, defense combative. I blessed with a job that givesme all this training but he takes on normal class to.

[redrumtc]

F krav here for about the same price you get tac training here's some class videos


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phRT0...e_gdata_player

[Guderian]

I visited Masada Tactical, but their class schedule did not work for me so some training was better than no training IMO. Basically, most of their classes are weeknights, but sometimes they meet too early for me to get to in time from work. They are closed Saturday, I believe (day of rest), and Sunday is reserved for special classes. But, check out both places like I did and decide for yourself. For me, Krav Maga had more convenient schedule, and, for my single membership, I can go to both Columbia and Owings Mills, which allows me even more flexibility to make a class.

Like your patches redrum

[redrumtc]

Let me talk to BK we are those special classes we go every Thursday see if pay u can train with us. I don't know how much he will charge.

[redrumtc]

I was with 121st for 2years then the 58th for 4the years.just got done my 8

[2much2do49]

The title of your thread caught my attention, as the reason why I've taken up shooting is because I can't train bjj anymore due to injury. I trained for about 7 years and loved it! But one too many guillotines and my neck is screwed up (note to self; tap early rather than late).

But I think the most important training is in your mind. Just be aware of your surroundings, avoid certain areas, be cognizant of what's happening around you. I don't care what type of training you have, if you get jumped by 4-6 guys you're going to take a pounding.

And the comment about running away is spot on. If its fishy, walk away if you can. If you can't, then yes, any type of training will help.

[BamaBob]

I would love to get back into martial arts but I haven't seen a good school for what I want to do. I have a lifetime Bally's as well so it gets really hard to suddenly start spending $100+ as opposed to $10/month.

I have a pet peeve when it comes to these schools- none of them just post their prices on their website. It feels like I'm going into a used car lot. It just seems like a shady practice to not tell people up front what things cost and then lock them into a long term contract. No matter how much I like a style or think the instructors are incredible, if it costs $150/month I'm not ever going to sign up for it, so why waste people's time by not stating it up front.

[Walter]

Originally Posted by Minuteman

I started to realize I was so out of shape when I was getting out of breath walking up a few flights of stairs; it was affecting my strength, coordination, balance. I can say now that thanks largely to MMA, I'm more fit now than a couple years ago. Last year I ran only one 5K race (30 min); this year I've already committed and paid up for two 10K races, and this years Fredrick Tough Mudder (12 miles with obstacles). Oddly so far I haven't lost much weight, but I've put away my larger clothes. I've done very little diet wise, taking that part slowest, but progressing. I'm planning to try a swimming regime this summer when the pool opens.

There are 240 Krav gyms worldwide, the closest to me is in Columbia, others are in Owingmills, DC, Gathersberg, http://www.kravmaga.com/locations/li...ining-centers/
I've only visited Krav Columbia one other time before my half day of exhaustive training with them, so my opinion is of little value. One guy in the four I teamed up with said he drove from North Carolina to participate in this half day session. Krav instructors all seem highly motivated and dedicated to get the most out of students, pushing the limits while practicing a 'relative' degree of safety. True Krav was designed to be simple enough to teach a typical soldier the entire technique in 6-8 weeks (3 hours a day); the commercial Krav program says it takes the average student 6-9 months to complete level 1 (there are 5 levels). ? ! $

There were some big BIG boys in the class, more woman than I expected (~8%), some skinny, small, few folks over 50, about 25% had super physique. I say if you have the time/money/motivation do it. They will push your limits, you probably won't get injured enough to miss work, and after a few months of dedicated attendance and effort, you will be stronger, more confident and capable both physically and mentally.

I have not yet decided to join them, but I'm running out of excuses and not getting younger.

I definitely understand the out of shape part. About 2 years ago I first tried Krav. I was fat then so it was tough - the warm ups alone almost killed me

I plan to sign up again near the end of the year.. reason is I'm bodybuilding for the next 8 months or so. I've got a very strict regimen when I BB - controlling exactly what and how much I eat, the exact amount of cardio I need to do, how long I need to rest to recover, etc. I've basically just got everything down to a science to operate as efficiently as possible.. and throwing Krav or any other unaccounted physical activity in is just going to screw me up.


Does anyone have any schools they can recommend near the Hyattsville area? I'm willing to drive 30-40 minutes, but not really looking forward to driving more than that. I'd like a school that is straight to the point, that teaches Krav like it was originally created - to defend yourself as effectively as possible and leave your attacker unable to continue being a threat to your life. No sugarcoating things or treating it as a sport or some sort of fancy show/gimmick like I've seen on too many Youtube videos.

[martinithebun]

Unless you're politically connected, you probably won't have your gun with you when you need it. The krav classes I took were one of my best investments.

[Mossberg Kid]

I used to train in, and teach, ninjutsu (the way of the ninja), or ninpo budo taijutsu, as it is more properly known in the more traditional iteration, or to-shin do, in the modern, Americanized adaptation. Both are extremely adaptable to the practitioner, and can equip you to be as gentle or as lethal as you want/need. Muay Thai would be my second recommendation. Hard to find a qualified teacher, but worth the effort.

[Kilroy]

It is my opinion that most martial arts are ineffective bullcrap. Akido, Wing Chun, KFS and those types of systems are a complete waste of time. I'm not trolling, hear me out.

In order to train realistically, you must train against a non-compliant, unpredictable opponent. Obviously you can't actually have a fight, so you have to have rules that prevent injury. (Tapping out, no eye gouges, etc) A system that allows for full speed, non-compliant sparring is best for self-defense. If your gym trains with one person as the attacker and one person defending, it's bullshido. If your gym drills moves with a compliant partner, it's a garbage system (Akido). If your gym never competes in tournaments, I'd question the value of that training. In competition, the opponent really, really wants to kick your butt. That's as close to a real fight as it's going to get. Competition also shows that your system works against a skilled opponent with different training.

Basically, if you don't want to waste your time, take Boxing, Muay Thai, BJJ, Judo or similar arts.
Krav Maga is good, but understand that it's a quick, dirty, and effective system. There is no "getting good" at KM, after 6 months you know what there is to know. (and you should be able to defend yourself)

[Mike OTDP]

Originally Posted by Yoshi

No "one" art is the "best".

Truth. The human body only works and breaks in so many ways, which means that while different styles may emphasize different approaches, they all are headed for the same objective.

Quality of instruction is far more important than the exact style.

[BigMBobbyOP]

Here is my take on things after training in MA for ~15 years:

Number 1 is that *any* training is better than no training.

Number 2 is that a lot of the sort of 'mixed' or 'reality based' systems provide a low level of competency - which is not necessarily a bad thing (see #1).

These styles will to teach you to punch & kick a guy, how to escape from a bear hug or grab, etc. What you will *not* learn here is how to properly and efficiently execute, with a high level of mastery, the basic components of those moves.

For example, you may practice striking combinations on a bag or vs a person but your training will not be geared towards perfecting the punch or kick you've just thrown. It will most always be on the practical application of those punches, kicks, escapes, etc.

I believe that the *specific* training of one art is more beneficial (which may be then augmented later). It is also my opinion that the *cumulative* effect of training a 'mixed' style as above DOES NOT add up to the sum of its parts.

For example, say you've got someone who has trained some 'reality based' or 'mixed' style up against a dedicated Judo or BJJ practitioner. Provided equal amounts of training on both sides, my bet is, percentage wise, on the dedicated practitioner.

To be a jack of all trades in the fighting world, IMO is worth *far* less than mastery of one solid art.

With this as a background, you can relatively easily come to *competency* in an art while it takes years to reach a high level of mastery. Therefore the person who has put in the years to reach a high level may now augment the training to come to competency in other areas and thus retain an, IMO, overwhelming advantage.

This is what we are seeing the MMA world with the champions being masters of one art who have augmented their training to complement their base game.

my .02

[Mike OTDP]

+1 on that, too. You're much better off to master one art, then start complementing it with other material.

[OldSchool1959]

Reading this thread made me chuckle. Mostly the comments about Krav Maga (KM). The funniest one is that the just warm up can wear you out. At 52, no truer statement has ever been made. I signed my son and me up for the six month at the Columbia gym a few weeks ago and am enjoying it so far. I'm former Navy, have trained in tae kwon do and boxing many years ago. I'm fat now but won't be after six months of KM.
FYI, KM does have a ground game. It's part of Lvl 1 and Lvl 2 from what I've seen. It's just not a focus.
Finally, I agree completely agree that some martial arts training is better than none if for no other reason than to heighten your awareness, identify soft points and create that "I can handle myself if I need to" self esteem.

[Steve973]

Speaking from a practical perspective, there are a few things to keep in mind. You definitely need to know how to handle different phases of fighting. Sometimes people will attack by striking (punching, kicking, etc) and sometimes they will attack by grabbing. If you focus too much on one style, you'll be vulnerable to the other style. If the style you're learning is too form-focused or too technical, and if it skips over the practical application of your learning, and if it removes aggression, you will probably freeze up if you have to use your training in a real situation.

For this reason, it is good to strike a good balance between striking and grappling, and between technique and aggression. I think that any style taken for practical application needs to have full-on sparring.

I won't particularly endorse any style, since that is something to be decided on by the individual student, but I like Krav Maga and mixed styles for the above reasons. I am no expert, but take what I said for whatever it's worth.