Torn between 2 Arsenal AKs, SGL31-95 vs SAM7R-61

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  • klatekin

    Member
    Jul 29, 2013
    7
    Hello MD shooters
    Could use some advice on which Arsenal AK to buy.
    I would like to eventually add 2 Arsenal AKs to my collection, one 5.45, one 7.62.
    Both the SGL31-95 and SAM7R-61 are currently available in stock and around the same price.

    I have been saving up for the SGL31-95 for a while and would have went with it except current receivers are marked FIME group instead of Arsenal which have me hesitant. (will Arsenal marked receivers ever come back?)

    Stamped vs Milled receiver, foldering stock vs intermediate length stock, 7.62 vs 5.45
    So my question is which one do you think is a better deal to purchase now?

    Thanks in advance
     

    why2kmax

    Jacka$$
    Nov 22, 2008
    1,180
    Shrewsbury PA
    In the Engage Armament section, when they got in their shipment of SGL-31s they stated:

    Arsenal Bulgaria will no longer be exporting to Arsenal USA anymore so the SLR series will be gone shortly after the last shipment arrives. According to our guy at K-Var, the Russians rose the prices on the last batch of Saiga rifles 30% and are now quoting 40% for further batches. So even the SGL series are up in the air. Anyway, either they wont be imported and converted by Arsenal anymore or prices will rise substantially. Not that it really matters for us since that will be post October. So...

    I have an SLR-95 and love it. YMMV
     

    Jimbob2.0

    Ultimate Member
    Feb 20, 2008
    16,600
    Thats a tough one. The advantage of the SAM7R is it is milled, frankly it doesnt do anything for performance but in long term value of the gun will pay off as milled guns have always commanded much higher prices. Largely due to relative scarcity and a perception that they are better than stamped.

    I have both in several platforms and the barrel is a much greater variable than the reciever ever will be.
     

    klatekin

    Member
    Jul 29, 2013
    7
    I have both the sgl21 and sgl31. Both are awesome guns.
    Great to hear thanks. Do you have any opinion on the SAM7R?

    In the Engage Armament section, when they got in their shipment of SGL-31s they stated:

    Arsenal Bulgaria will no longer be exporting to Arsenal USA anymore so the SLR series will be gone shortly after the last shipment arrives. According to our guy at K-Var, the Russians rose the prices on the last batch of Saiga rifles 30% and are now quoting 40% for further batches. So even the SGL series are up in the air. Anyway, either they wont be imported and converted by Arsenal anymore or prices will rise substantially. Not that it really matters for us since that will be post October. So...

    I have an SLR-95 and love it. YMMV
    Thanks for the information.

    Thats a tough one. The advantage of the SAM7R is it is milled, frankly it doesnt do anything for performance but in long term value of the gun will pay off as milled guns have always commanded much higher prices. Largely due to relative scarcity and a perception that they are better than stamped.

    I have both in several platforms and the barrel is a much greater variable than the reciever ever will be.
    Thanks for the info. Does the SGL31 and SAM7R share the same barrel?
     

    aquaman

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 21, 2008
    7,499
    Belcamp, MD
    i dont believe kvar's(bulgaria) ********. they love to milk the cash cow americans, same with the russians. the indian army & venezuela aren't paying 1k for a 100 series lol
     

    Scott7891

    Love those Combloc guns
    Sep 4, 2007
    1,894
    Back in MD sadly
    I have been saving up for the SGL31-95 for a while and would have went with it except current receivers are marked FIME group instead of Arsenal which have me hesitant. (will Arsenal marked receivers ever come back?)

    It is because of pressure from the Russians considering Arsenal is a competitor therefore KVAR set up a shell company to strictly deal with Saiga's.

    It has the same exact build specs as the previous Arsenal marked ones since it is the same company. That being the case they did take off milspec markings making it more commercial. If you want the milspec markings go for the SGL-31-94 which has them.

    Otherwise both are quality guns you can't go wrong with either.
     

    Scott7891

    Love those Combloc guns
    Sep 4, 2007
    1,894
    Back in MD sadly
    i dont believe kvar's ********. they love to milk the cash cow americans, same with the russians. the indian army & venezuela aren't paying 1k for a 100 series lol

    Yea but since they are for government use only they don't need to pay tariffs, worry about making a profit, and don't need to make any changes to suit our ridiculous import laws.

    Plus Venezuela and Argentina are building them in house now.
     

    klatekin

    Member
    Jul 29, 2013
    7
    i dont believe kvar's ********. they love to milk the cash cow americans, same with the russians. the indian army & venezuela aren't paying 1k for a 100 series lol
    I hear ya, the price is tough to swallow for sure but with no skills to do my own conversion, my options for a higher end ak are limited and I need an ak in my life right now lol:lol:
     

    klatekin

    Member
    Jul 29, 2013
    7
    It is because of pressure from the Russians considering Arsenal is a competitor therefore KVAR set up a shell company to strictly deal with Saiga's.

    It has the same exact build specs as the previous Arsenal marked ones since it is the same company. That being the case they did take off milspec markings making it more commercial. If you want the milspec markings go for the SGL-31-94 which has them.

    Otherwise both are quality guns you can't go wrong with either.
    I see. I would love a SGL31-94 but can't find one for sale anywhere:sad20:
     

    rob-cubed

    In need of moderation
    Sep 24, 2009
    5,387
    Holding the line in Baltimore
    Like Scott7891 said, FIME is the new Arsenal for SGLs. Same base rifle from Izhmash, same conversion process, still owned by Arsenal USA.

    That said, it's overpriced compared to the milled SAM... milled will keep its value better (generally speaking) than stamped. While I'm a fan of 5.45, I'd go for the milled for investment reasons. Or go SLR for 5.45 and save bundles on ammo as long as you don't mind cleaning.
     

    Jimbob2.0

    Ultimate Member
    Feb 20, 2008
    16,600
    Great to hear thanks. Do you have any opinion on the SAM7R?


    Thanks for the information.


    Thanks for the info. Does the SGL31 and SAM7R share the same barrel?

    Should be better, the arsenal hammer forged barrels are legenday
     

    klatekin

    Member
    Jul 29, 2013
    7
    Like Scott7891 said, FIME is the new Arsenal for SGLs. Same base rifle from Izhmash, same conversion process, still owned by Arsenal USA.

    That said, it's overpriced compared to the milled SAM... milled will keep its value better (generally speaking) than stamped. While I'm a fan of 5.45, I'd go for the milled for investment reasons. Or go SLR for 5.45 and save bundles on ammo as long as you don't mind cleaning.
    Thanks for the suggestion. I think I may go with the SAM7R now and keep an eye out for a SGL31-64 with Arsenal and milspec markings.
    Would love a SLR105 but too expensive to find.
    Should be better, the arsenal hammer forged barrels are legenday
    Good to hear SAM7R have better barrels.
     

    AssMan

    Meh...
    MDS Supporter
    Jan 27, 2011
    16,214
    Somewhere on the James River, VA
    Meh, how many folks shoot (or plan to shoot) their AK's past 100M or so? I sure don't. There are too many other rifles out there that fit that role. All of my sub $800 Ak's are usefully accurate and reliable out to 100M.

    Understanding that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, what do the Arsenals bring to the table to justify the significant $$$ increase? I mean, for less than the price of an Arsenal, I bought an O-PAP AND an M-10. I'm certainly not against paying more for an AK that is "better" - in fact, I've always wanted a high-end AK, but I haven't bought one because I don't understand what additional benefit I'm getting for my $$$. Someone please fill me in, because otherwise I'm spending my last pre-ban dollars on a non AK platform rifle.
     

    TheBulge

    Active Member
    Mar 7, 2011
    344
    I vote for the SAM7R
     

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    klatekin

    Member
    Jul 29, 2013
    7
    Meh, how many folks shoot (or plan to shoot) their AK's past 100M or so? I sure don't. There are too many other rifles out there that fit that role. All of my sub $800 Ak's are usefully accurate and reliable out to 100M.

    Understanding that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, what do the Arsenals bring to the table to justify the significant $$$ increase? I mean, for less than the price of an Arsenal, I bought an O-PAP AND an M-10. I'm certainly not against paying more for an AK that is "better" - in fact, I've always wanted a high-end AK, but I haven't bought one because I don't understand what additional benefit I'm getting for my $$$. Someone please fill me in, because otherwise I'm spending my last pre-ban dollars on a non AK platform rifle.
    The M-10 is very nice, too bad I missed them for $600 couple days ago.
    I vote for the SAM7R
    :party29:
     

    aquaman

    Ultimate Member
    Sep 21, 2008
    7,499
    Belcamp, MD
    I hear ya, the price is tough to swallow for sure but with no skills to do my own conversion, my options for a higher end ak are limited and I need an ak in my life right now lol:lol:

    If your in MD you have no choice, Oct. 1 is close so you have to bend over for kvar and Ivan if you want a 100 series. Which really pisses me off because I know that they have the same soviet quota system, lax qc standards,drunk by noon and would sure as shit sell you an AK for 1000 rubles, a loaf of bread and some cheap vodka.
     

    Scott7891

    Love those Combloc guns
    Sep 4, 2007
    1,894
    Back in MD sadly
    Meh, how many folks shoot (or plan to shoot) their AK's past 100M or so? I sure don't. There are too many other rifles out there that fit that role. All of my sub $800 Ak's are usefully accurate and reliable out to 100M.

    Understanding that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, what do the Arsenals bring to the table to justify the significant $$$ increase? I mean, for less than the price of an Arsenal, I bought an O-PAP AND an M-10. I'm certainly not against paying more for an AK that is "better" - in fact, I've always wanted a high-end AK, but I haven't bought one because I don't understand what additional benefit I'm getting for my $$$. Someone please fill me in, because otherwise I'm spending my last pre-ban dollars on a non AK platform rifle.

    I stated so in another thread but I'll repost it here:
    Honestly at this point buy an Arsenal. Yes they are expensive but for many good reasons.

    1) All imported from military arsenals (SGL's from Izhmash in Russia the place where they first made the AK, SLR series from Kazanlak in Bulgaria who is still the official arsenal of the Bulgarian military).
    2) Factory-spec receivers
    3) All brand new parts not an American mixmaster of dubious quality
    4) Hammer forged chrome lined machine gun grade barrels that will be able to shoot any type of ammo you buy
    5) Excellent build quality
    6) Holds its value so one can easily resell it if they don't like it
    7) Arsenal milled receivers are hot-die forged making them more durable than the Cold War era and domestic American milled receivers.........Also the cost to convert a standard Saiga to Arsenal specs would put it above the cost of an Arsenal that won't hold its value like an Arsenal would.

    The O-PAP doesn't have a chrome-lined bore (or any melinite/nitriding for that matter) meaning anything else but brass ammo you are wearing away the barrel at a much faster rate especially since all steel-cased ammo since 1994 use bimetallic projectiles.

    The M10 has had its fair share of lemons and is essentially a WASR with a Draco FSB/ Gas combo.
     

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